Grr-gripper question

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"Ba r r y" wrote in message

SEVEN DOLLARS for "jointer push blocks"??!! ... you must be rich. ;>)
Actually, that's what I thought until I actually scored a pair of subject devices. I do think they're pricy and that, unfortunately, puts the device into the realm of the "boy toy" for those who have more money than experience and must have one or two of everything and damn the cost.
However, if they cost only $12, my bet is that you would throw away those "$7 jointer push blocks" in a heartbeat, <G>
The bottom line for any tool/device/jig/whatever is whether you would replace it if it were lost or stolen ... I would be guilty in this case.
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On Fri, 15 Apr 2005 11:13:20 GMT, Ba r r y

The bright orange set of three ?
I've got a set of those - I should have saved the money. They're a nice idea and the bright orange colour stops me loosing them, but the black rubber base is poor quality and falls apart. When I realised this was leaving black marks on the workpiece, I had to replace it.
Next time I'd just make my own.
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On Fri, 15 Apr 2005 13:31:57 +0100, Andy Dingley

Mine are white.

Mine don't fall apart, but they weren't that "grippy" until they were introduced to 60 grit. These don't mark the wood, either.
Barry
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On 14 Apr 2005 20:33:56 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@ccrtc.com wrote:

First of all, that's a bandsaw job, just to avoid the kerf wastage and the risk of shattering brittle ebony. Secondly you rip it long and crosscut later.
I do rip 1/4" thick strips fairly often and I do it with a long stick that's a shade under 1/4" wide. This also has a long foot on it. Now this stick gives as good control of the workpiece as Grr-Ripper, keeps my hands further from the blade, but it does require rather more user dexterity.
If I was ripping lots of this material, I'd quite possibly make a Grr-Ripper-like device. If I only need it to work at one setting and not be adjustable, then this is easy. Even if I _liked_ the idea, this is still an expensive gadget and I can make my own.
The thing I just don't like about Grr-Ripper is the need to lower the sawblade. Now that in itself is a contributor to hazard - no safety device that requires you to change something to make it even more hazardous can be an entirely good thing.
Grr-Ripper is a clever device. It looks well made and well-thought out as a piece of engineering. If I were sawing grooves into shoji runners, I might well want such a device - a flat plate with a heel hook behind and a side straddle to stop it wobbling. But this is a pretty contrived example - I _have_ such pushblocks already (job-specific) and my point is that I'd never think of using them for ripping, because of the blade height.
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Andy, I have a lot of respect for you and your breadth of knowledge. I view you as renaissance man and you contribute a lot to this conference. I'm disappointed in reading this thread. I think you've ripped your britches giving such firm opinions about a device it appears you've never even used for a minute. It hurts your otherwise outstanding credibility.
Bob
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On Fri, 15 Apr 2005 13:51:43 GMT, "BillyBob"
That's a fair comment, in general don't listen to the guy who hasn't actually used it. And I might just be plain wrong - wouldn't be the first time. I'm still waiting to hear any rebuttal of my key point though.
I don't like this thing because it requires me to lower the blade when ripping, something I think is more dangerous than any advantage gained by using it. Now if you personally disagree over the positioning issue, then that's fair comment - but you don't need to _handle_ the Grr-Ripper to know that it's going to involve it.
There are a few cases when it could be useful. But for these I can make a push block as I need it - I don't need adjustability.
As an adjustable push block, it's a great piece of work. But I don't need an adjustable push block, and this is an expensive substitute for a simple non-adjustable one.
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I don't understand the mechanics of the danger of lowering the blade when ripping. Could you elaborate? My understanding is that kickback originates at the rear of the blade with the teeth catching the wood enough to kick it back. How does lowering the blade increase the likelihood of this process happening?
Thanks, Bob
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"BillyBob" wrote in message

originates
it
Think about it for a minute with the idea that, with the blade at its highest setting, the front teeth are now biting into the wood at an increased angle (almost straight down toward the table if the board is thin enough), thereby creating downward pressure (toward the table) on the board where the teeth are doing the cutting
If you try it, you will be able to actually feel that this increased downward pressure offsets a tendency for the board to rise up off the table while being cut when the blade is set lower.
Many feel this reduces the risk of kickback ... and a good argument can be made that every little factor in your favor helps.
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thin
board
You're forgetting one thing though. With the blade raised to it's maximum height, there's more blade in the meat of the wood increasing the chances of the wood pinching the blade and being hurled in a kickback. Of course, a splitter is supposed to protect against that, but a splitter is not infallible against this type of action. While you're probably right about the front teeth coming down on the wood pressing it into the table, the reverse is true on the back teeth coming up to the wood increasing the chances that it's going to raise the rear section of the wood setting up a kickback scenario.
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"Upscale" wrote in message

of
First off, I am not particularly an advocate of ultra high blades, I really don't care to argue any of the points, I was just trying to answer the question as to why some folks feel the way they do, and I haven't forgotten anything (well, that ain't exactly true cuz I am so damn tired of working 8 days a week here lately that I can't remember my own name half the time).
But do go out to the shop and see if you can't feel the difference between a high and low blade, particularly when first starting the cut.
All my life I have noticed the tendency of a board to "ride up" if the blade is low when ripping, and that tendency disappears with the blade set up high.
Hell, maybe I've just been dreaming that my touch with the saw has been good enough to "feel" that..
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<<All my life I have noticed the tendency of a board to "ride up" if the blade is low when ripping, and that tendency disappears with the blade set up high.>>
But that tendency can be counteracted when you are able to apply downward pressure on the workpiece in the vicinity of the blade while simultaneously applying lateral force to keep the piece tight to the fence, which is what I like most about the Grr-ripper.
Lee
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"Lee Gordon" wrote in message

simultaneously
I
I agree ... but It takes a week to walk to Dallas from here, which can be counteracted by using various other means of transportation. That doesn't change the underlying facts.
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Absurd comparison. Hope you're not planning on entering any debates soon.
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"Upscale" wrote in message

be
doesn't
LOL .. If you believe that, then you're most definitely out of your league. The underlying structural relationships in the 'analogy' are rock solid to any one capable of logical thought ... but you do have to be smart enough to recognize the parallels.
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soon.
league.
to
The structural relationship you are claiming between walking to Dallas and the Grr-gripper is simple equivocation and still meets the standard of absurdity. As far as saying I'm not smart enough to see the parallels, that's an ad hominem response and plainly demonstrates your poor debating skills, as I've already intimidated. It doesn't meet the standards of adequacy and fails to be acceptable. Come back when you have something a little more substantial to offer.
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<<Come back when you have something a little more substantial to offer.>>
It may be a while. He's walking to Dallas. <g>
Lee
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Upscale wrote: ...

That wud be intimated methinks, I doubt you'll intimidate Swingman. :)
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Yeah, mind thought one thing, fingers did something else and I didn't notice until I'd posted the message. I'm sure Swingman will attempt to use it to his advantage.
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"Upscale"wrote in message

can
to
enough
Ahh, but the shoe fits you too well ... and "ad hominen" was tit for tat in case you didn't even notice your ad hominem "debate" response.

Well, let's see if we can't get your elevator a little closer to the top floor:
In both instances there is an underlying problem in the realization of a goal, and various means to "counteract" the problem:
Goal Problem Possible Solution Rip cut - board rises - raise blade/use hold down device Get to Dallas - long walk - use device with motor/wheels/wings
Shame on you for not being able to figure out something so simple for yourself ... and so much for your qualifications on making judgments on others ability to "debate".
Now go fuck yourself.
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The childish comparison you used was simple to see. Anyone with even rudimentary language skills can form a relationship between two things, objects or words. That's simple logic. I dismissed the relationship you developed as being irrelevent because the two ideas were too foreign to each other.

Ahh, now we get down to the real sentiment of the discussion. Failing to prove any valid points, you've digressed to profanity. Very appropriate and more than anything else, demonstrates your lack of debating skills. Let's talk again sometime when you've got something more apropos to say.
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