I was in a tool shop t'other day (Axminster) and noticed a lovely display of Festool tools, so naturally I went over to have a sneaky grope and see what all the fuss is about. They are clearly a cut above the kind of power tool I am used to using (just hobby & DIY) but... the prices! THE PRICES! Why are they so expensive? They are undoubtedly nice units, but they seem to be inordinately expensive -
500 quid for a cordless driver, 120 quid for an LED work lamp, etc etc... The most expensive thing I saw was a router for 700-and- something pounds.
So why are they so costly? And more importantly, are they worth the money?
Do you believe the old saying that the last 15% of the project is 85% of the cost? Or do you prefer the one that says sell the sizzle and not the steak?
On Wed, 1 Feb 2012 15:46:30 -0800 (PST), David Paste
It depends on what you're looking for. When you get into the finer aspects of woodworking, the difference between top notch and a little less so is reasonably fine.
Most every Festool owner (and I am one of them), really likes the dust collection of their tools. This includes their routers and their sanders. The first Festool I ever bought was the Domino, which is a unique tool.
If you feel you need some type of impetus to push you over the edge when it comes to buying, I'd suggest the Domino as a first purchase. And most definitely yes, it is expensive. But then, it stands far above your average doweling jig or biscuit joiner. Most every Festool dealer holds a 'Festool day' once in awhile. You should attend one or find a dealer that does. Until then, you can check out the Festool Owner's Group which is a web site dedicated to everything woodworking as well as other topics. It's for everybody, not just for use by Festool owners.
If you are a hobbyist, the price will look high unless you appreciate quality and a tool that will last.
If you are a pro and or make a living with your tools you will find that the price is reasonable.
Festool is one of a few manufacturers that has enough pride in what it does to actually design and manufacture the product themselves. Naturally they know what they are doing, know how to build a tool, and that is going to cost more money than buying a "clone tool" made in China.
Where time is money, Festool delivers top quality results in less time.
Imagine cutting 200 "clean precision sized" mortises. Now imagine doing them in less than an hour.
Imagine sanding with a belt sander. Now imagine sanding with a finish sander that will sand as fast as a belt sander with no dust and little noise by comparison.
Imagine building fine furniture and making your cuts with a circular saw. Now imagine a circular saw the cuts as good as a cabinet table saw, makes plunge cuts, puts a fine straight edge on a board faster than a jointer, and contains 95% of the saw dust.
Imagine a shop vac. Now imagine a dust extractor that has a hepa filter, so quiet that you cannot hear it running when working with a connected power tool, and allows you to stack all of your power tools in top.
Imagine a cordless drill. Now imagine one that does not rattle and clatter when you have reached the desired torque setting but simply stops turning and sounds a tone to indicate that you have reached the desired torque setting and will not continue until you release and pull the trigger again, one that has a right angle, eccentric, quick change chuck for drivers, and will continue to run if you drop it in a bucket of water.
Not to mention that with the 30 day money back guarantee you can't be fooled into buying something that does not live up to or beyond your expectations.
Sounds like you could be supplementing your income by being a copy writer for Festool. ;~)
One of my local associates, whom has a commercial shop, has a shelf unit full of Festool in his shop. I recently saw him sell off some Dewalt tools... Seems he found the same things you did...
On a serious note though I was never really aware of Festool, not on the radar.
Then one day many years ago, 6 or 7, Robatoy showed me a link to the German Festool site, all in German, that showed a video of a tool for creating mortises. And at that time he was going on and on and on about this Rotex, feminine product sounding name, sander.
When the Domino was introduced here, in English but not yet available, I decided I was going to buy one. Ah but you need to use a vac with it and my days of listening to the inexpensive shop vac's were over so I bought the Festool CT22 dust extractor and the Domino assortment. I dropped major money on those three items.
Damn, the vac worked much better than expected and it was quiet. These tools are great and fast!
A year later came the Rotex sander, several months later small finish sander. No more dust!
Christmas two years ago Swingman got the bug and was "bad sick" with Festool need. He bought the CT22 dust extractor, T75 Track saw, accessory kit, other tracks, Rotex sander and finish sander.
I tried his track saw and WOW. Four months later I added the Festool TS75 track saw and an extra track.
Yes, I'd use my horizontal morticer, or benchtop morticer or if I had one, a chain morticer. None of which cost as much as the Domino (well the chain morticer would have to have been a used model, of course).
Don't have one, never needed one. Now a wide-belt sander or good drum sander on the other hand ...
How about a card scraper, #80, #81 or #112? Or a PC 7336 6" right-angle ROS with dust collection kit if you must use power?
These two thoughts don't go together.
But if I already have a jointer, cabinet saw, and a dust collector, why do I need this?
Sure as hell aint worth the extra USD700 over a Dewalt 18V.
That's nice, but still you've given me no reason to purchase the festool stuff. I haven't seen it in the pro cabinet shops that I frequent, either.
There are some things that you just have to experience to understand. ;~)
Absolutely. I sell a majority of my work. In the last 4 years I have used in excess of 1800 Domino tenons in just the 5mm thick size. That works out to 3600 mortises. In a bed that I built this last summer with under mount drawers I cut 112 precisely placed mortices in the upper sections of the headboards. 56 of those mortices were in the ends of
1.5" wide slats. I did that in less than 1 hour. And no a Plate joiner/biscuit jointer would not have worked. I needed these slats to be stationary during glue up and assembly, I had 28 separate joints, 56 tennons all coming together at one time during glue up. With biscuits I would have had parts falling out. Using a mortiser I suspect that at best that would have been an all day job so that saved me at least $315 of my time. That was 112 mortices and I have cut well in excess of 3600 in the last 4 years. You can do the math here but I am able to turn out higher quality work much more quickly with the Domino.
If you are a hobbyist the savings will be significantly less unless you are short on work shop time and you value your free time.
Well to be fair and comparing apples to apples, the new Rolls is going to cost 10 times more than the average new car.
A new Festool is only about 2.5 times more expensive than the average new brand power tool.
And as I mentioned above you really have to work with the tool to appreciate the difference. When you spend all day week in the shop week after week Festool proves itself time and again.
Go time yourself and cut 200 1/4" by 1" by 1" mortices with any of the tools that would cost less than a Domino.
Then how long will it take to cut the 100 tenons to fit precicely with no play?
I am not buying it just considering cutting the mortises.
Given enough time you can sand anything to conform with a block of wood and sand paper.
If you are into that kind of thing and have plenty of time. I have the older version of the PC 7336 right angle sander. I used it from 1989 until about 3 years ago. It was a very good sander. The Rotex was the first right angle sander that I saw that was significantly better.
I use mine to cut sheets of plywood to finish sizes by myself. I use mine to cut odd angle and taper cuts that are difficult at best on a TS. It makes life easier.
Well I only paid about $350 more that a DeWalt. New mine was is only $575. Not sure where you are getting your pricing. But does did your DeWalt have the right angle attachment, eccentric and quick drive change attachment?
Well Scott I am not trying to sell you on buying Festool, I simply stated why I bought Festool and how it is a benefit to me.
As someone other than a hobbyist, I'll buy a tool any day that in ten years will have cost you less than $5/month, and you're still good to go for another ten, and more.
Festool's not for everyone ... until you experience what owning a Festool can do for making you money, most simply won't "get it".
Hell, the Festool _dust collection_ ability alone has literally saved me enough in _onsite dust control measures_ to easily pay for the rest of my Festool aresenal five times over.
You bet I can justify owning Festool ... at twice the price if necessary.
When I first got the Rotek sander it threw me for a loop. I was used to judging how much had been done by the sawdust. I had to keep checking to be sure it was sanding because there wasn't any sawdust.
It is a good analogy but is is not a good comparison.
Monster cables crack me up. I never could understand how people could actually miss the teeney weeney looking uninsulated wire that protruded out of the clear "MAGNIFYING" insulation.
LOL I just got through mentioning that about the Festool detail sander.
I did not have as much trouble with the Rotex which I got first as it is relative easy to see the progress on the work. Going to a finish sander where you are not reshaping so to speak really concerned me.
AND THE PAPER! It seldom looks worn out, I had to learn to give it a finger feel on a regular basis.
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