Advice needed for sliding door project run amok

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On 03/17/2015 1:17 PM, dpb wrote: ...

Just in round numbers a 4-lite panel would have roughly 12x14" panels whereas 6-lite would work out a about 8x14" if two high. No idea what the rest looks like; could envision it "lookin' good!!!", depending... :)
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On 03/17/2015 4:03 PM, dpb wrote:

...
BTW, the key is that if you make more, smaller panels, you'll find the needed stiffness won't be as much to retain them flat as the single larger since there's less bend to remove from each. I'd still work on reducing the initial stress levels first, though...
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On 3/17/2015 2:17 PM, dpb wrote:

I am going to try to make 2" wide frames out of some scrap pine to see if they will hold the panels flat. I think I will join them with half lap joints for now. If that works, I might try miters with splines. TBD
I don't know the ply core. I don't have an instrument for RH but we have oil heat and it has been a VERY cold winteand spring so far (27 for a high today) so we had more (dry) heat than usual. The boards were stored in a vertical position, longest edge down. I will just do my experiment and see what happens.
I am still pursing a source for Lexan
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Dick Snyder wrote:

------------------------------------------------------ Do a google (I use DuckDuckGo.com) of the following:
acrylic sheet distributors boston area
BTW, Lexan more expensive than acrylic.
Lew3
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On 03/18/2015 2:46 PM, Dick Snyder wrote: ...

And, if that is reasonably successful, the cherry or other hardwood will be stiffer. As noted, also, if you go to 2 (or 4 or 6) instead of just 1 panel you add stiffness and reduce the amount of force needed at the same time (at the cost of more fabrication effort, of course, ain't no free lunch :) )

Try laying flat covered on clean, dry non-staining material and place a plastic over it with a water dish under to let it pick up some. Sticker it so it's got circulation space both sides and add some weight to the top...see if it will acclimatize back to a more nearly uniform flatter position then after that when it is brought back to a dry environment.
Have smaller panels just oversize what you need makes this easier to handle from space considerations obviously...
On edge is really not a good way to store ply altho often given room limitations it's the only practical solution.
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wrote:

The idea is that one panel is offset to the outside of the track and the other to the inside. They will still pass by each other, just as the bare panels do but the "inner" door will cut into the interior space a bit.
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On 03/15/2015 7:06 PM, snipped-for-privacy@zzz.com wrote:

Precisely, and better worded besides... :)
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On 3/14/2015 5:05 PM, Max wrote:

Very nicely done!
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On 3/16/2015 12:02 PM, Swingman wrote:

Thank You.
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On 3/14/2015 5:57 PM, Swingman wrote:

There are two doors, each 30" high and 37" wide. They need to be able to pass by each other so that half of the shelves are open at a time. The shelves will store cook books etc. I don't see yet how frame and panel doors would be able to pass by each other in the space (depth) that I have. My current thinking is to find some other 1/4" thick material that is stiff and would allow me to keep my basic design.
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On 3/14/2015 5:12 PM, Dick Snyder wrote:

If the design permits, go for it.
Doesn't sound like that option would break the bank.
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wrote:

Tempered glass would be my suggestion for 30X37" doors that cannot be over 1/4" thick - or 6061T6 aluminum.
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On 3/14/2015 3:18 PM, Dick Snyder wrote:

Your kidding right? You must always finish both sides of whatever you work on. you need it to get the same humidity all around. Sealing one side allows moisture to directly come in to the untreated side and thats all that needed. You must seal the edges too.

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Kinda like welding sheet stock to a base. Weld one side and the standing sheet bends in the weld. Welding the other side won't fix it.
One tack welds back and forth on both sides - once tacked in then weld.
The idea is for wood also - coating one side might at first relax that side but as the coating is dried it shrinks. Putting it on both sides causes it to shrink in back to back motions that counteracts the forces.
Martin
On 3/14/2015 2:18 PM, Dick Snyder wrote:

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Dick Snyder wrote:

I have used 1/4" ply without problems but only smaller doors (up to 18"-24" high).
I have also used it in bigger doors with the same result as you. In fact, I have 4 cabinet doors - about 36" tall - in an upper cabinet in our laundry room with that problem but they are frame & panel, not sliding. I posted about them many months ago, the general consensus was that it was the frame warping, not the ply. I disagree, they will be remade someday.
Even in smaller doors, I have had occasional minor problems. My fix was to glue a piece of wood across them at top & bottom. That works but you need enough space between them. The best solution is to use thicker ply, same caveat about space.
For a non-warping panel for your current needs, I would suggest Masonite (hardboard). It is butt-ugly but can be painted nicely. Or covered with wallpaper. Or even veneered (both sides). In either case, should you go that route, search out hardboard that has NOT been made on a screen; that results in one smooth side, one rough. You would want both to be smooth (or at least I would).
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On 3/14/2015 3:46 PM, dadiOH wrote:

I think I now understand why all the reviewers of the Rockler bypass door sliders were able to use 1/4" plywood. Their doors were not as big as mine.
I do not have enough space between the doors to put in a stiffener. I am going to call my plywood supplier to see if they have any better ideas. Otherwise I may go with painted hardboard.
Thanks for helping me understand why I got the warping.
Dick
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This is a bit of a long shot, but if you have a source of 1/16" veneers you could try making up your own plywood. Put the two inner layers at 45 degrees to the outer layer (and 90 degrees to each other, of course), and use epoxy (West System or System Three or similar) to glue it all together. You'll want to glue it up on something flat, and have another something flat to put on top together with a bunch of weights while the glue dries (and plastic wrap between so you don't glue your panel to it). The result will be a lot stiffer than any commercial panel.
Otherwise I'd be tempted to go with Gordon's suggestion of frosted glass.
John
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On Sat, 14 Mar 2015 22:18:43 +0000 (UTC), John McCoy

Another thought - try to get "aircraft grade" plywood - 45degree instead of 90, and all veneers "A" grade.
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John McCoy wrote:

I'm thinking a piece of 1/4" x 30" x 37" glass might be a tad heavy to slide around. If I were OP and was going to use glass, would use four pieces, rather than two. He could still access the same amount of space.
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A very good point. Four at 30" x 18.5" would be much more manageable, both in use and in installation.
John
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