What is this white scratchy stuff on the sides and bottom of my pool?

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On Sun, 06 May 2012 23:07:15 -0500, gonjah wrote:

I agree with you! But it's too late for me. There is no vacuum attachment anywhere, so the only vacuum that would work would be a wholly self contained one.
BTW, there 'is' an unused port that goes from the middle of the pool to the pump area. It is capped off but I guess I 'could' put a pump there (my fourth) and it would then act as a vacuum. But it would have to have its own filter because there's already a filter loop.
Weird. Very weird. It took me a while to figure it out because everything people told me didn't make sense when I had tested it (e.g., to use the skimmers as a vacuum).
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On 5/6/2012 11:14 PM, Arklin K. wrote:

You gotta go with what you got. Hopefully someone with this type of pool experience will chime in on Monday.

I'd think there is a vacuum attachment somewhere already.
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On Sun, 06 May 2012 23:19:15 -0500, gonjah wrote:

Well, truth be told, there is ... sort of.
It's a real bear, but ... I read the Paramount PCC2000 documentation really carefully - over and over and over again ... and I found out you CAN attach a vacuum to the debris canister!
But, it's a bear! You have to fill the hose with water and then very very quickly (before the water leaks out), you shove the hose into the bottom of the debris canister - and - if you're lucky - you get vacuum.
But, it seems you slow down the intake of water so the filter pump almost goes dry - with huge bubbles of caviation or whatever in the pump basket.
So you're constantly going back and forth to the pump to check that it's not dry while you're vacuuming with the hose that keeps popping out of the debris canister and you have to prime the entire hose over and over and over again.
At least that's what happens to me.
Here's where it says you can do hook a vacuum to the debris canister. http://www.1paramount.com/products/canister
It works nice in the picture at that web page - but - in reality, it's a real bear. My kids learn new swear words every time I try to get it going as it's a 3-person operation ... - Two people to prime the hose - One person to vacuum - And another to keep checking that the filter pump doesn't go dry
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On 5/6/2012 11:28 PM, Arklin K. wrote:

I laughed but it's not funny. Vacuuming is a little tricky on my pool too but nothing like that.
I've only done it about 3 times in 5 years because I have a polaris.
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On Sun, 06 May 2012 21:28:30 +0000, Arklin K. wrote:

I finally figured it out! http://picturepush.com/public/8204328
The trick is to NOT set the tool too deeply into the popup head when turning clockwise to remove (yes, clockwise).
When I set the tool deeply, it broke the tool.
When I set the tool shallow - it twisted the pop-up head the 1/8 turn that releases it from the pool! Lesson learned! http://picturepush.com/public/8204315
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On Mon, 07 May 2012 03:59:41 +0000, Arklin K. wrote:

Thanks everyone for your support!
You give me the courage to keep going, even in the face of adversity.
Each hint moves me closer to the solution.
This is a great USENET newsgroup!
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On Tue, 08 May 2012 08:21:21 -0700, SMS wrote:

Yuck. Yes. Mine was actually whitish blue after the $150 chemical treatment ... but now it's bone dry! http://picturepush.com/public/8216614
If you were able to bring yours back to life, should should I be able to. In the picture below you see all the green soupy slop I was shoveling out yesterday. Now it's finally clean of green. http://picturepush.com/public/8216624
I will try to wash it with the 29% muriatic acid I bought from Leslies today.
How does this sound as a wash procedure? Note: I gleaned this from multiple DIYs - many of which conflict!
0. Wear protective clothing & equipment & go section by section. - goggles, mask, gloves, boots, + respirator (acid fumes are heavier than air & you're standing in a big tub) - don't acid wash a vinyl or above-ground pool (only plaster in-ground pools) - acid actually removes a very thin layer of the plaster, which is about 1.5 inches thick to start with - some suggest washing and brushing with trisodiumphosphate (TSP) before doing an acid wash - don't let the TSP stay for too long 1. Set up a submersible pump in the deep end to pump out the acidified water - neutralize water with 2 pounds of soda ash for every gallon of 14.5% HCl 2. Pour one gallon of water into a pump sprayer - never add water to acid 3. Add one gallon of 14.5% muriatic acid (HCl) to that one gallon of water (I wonder if vinegar will work?) - half a gallon if 29% HCl (each article has a different ratio - and some even use it full strength!) - some suggest 8% to 10% final concentration of muriatic acid - one gallon of 10% solution will cover about 100 sq ft 4. Some say to add dish detergent to the mix - this DIY says dish detergent is reputed to lessen the fumes 5. From above, spray the walls with water from a garden hose - start at the deep end and work your way to the shallow end - one 5-foor-wide or 10-foot-wide section at a time 6. Pour the acid/water mixture down the side of the pool - having a helper topside is recommended 7. Wait 30 seconds for the acid to do its work, and then scrub the walls with an acid brush - some say to wait for the bubbling to stop - all say to not allow the acid to stay for too long - an acid brush has a wood handle with heavy bristles 8. Rince thoroughly with water - ensure the submersible pump is pumping the neutrilized water out of the deep end to a safe location - make sure the water path doesn't etch a channel in the pool (keep rinsing the path) - some suggest a scrubbing with TSP to neutralize the acid 9. You may need to repeat
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On 5/8/2012 12:23 PM, Arklin K. wrote:

i'd make sure the respirator is rated for acids, or i'd get a positive pressure respirator. you need a source for clean pressurized air for this, or you could wear scuba equipment.
the fumes will eat anything metal in the area, including things outside the pool.

the plaster is very thin, maybe at most 1/4". underneath that is gunite usually, which is a type of cement. gunite is also affected by acid, so you don't want to eat through the plaster.
the acid will also leave the plaster a bit rougher, which will give algae a place to start forming. that will make cleaning it later harder, so you have to be more careful with your chemical balance.

only if it's dirty.

neutralize it before pumping. make sure it's an acid safe pump, and note where you're pumping it to.

make sure it's an acid safe sprayer

i doubt this

the bubbling will stop when the calcium has neutralized all the acid, and it's no longer acid.

btw: if you do this wrong, you can destroy the pool, and it can kill you. some things are better left to people who have at least done this once successfully before.
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On Tue, 08 May 2012 13:22:37 -0700, chaniarts wrote:

Hmmm... maybe I will reconsider ...
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On Tue, 08 May 2012 16:11:32 -0700, SMS wrote:

Wow. That's one heck of a project. I especially like the penultimate picture! :)

How can the pool cleaner not need the pump running?
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On 5/6/2012 3:39 AM, Arklin K. wrote:

I don't know but nice pool.
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On Sun, 06 May 2012 10:05:48 -0500, gonjah wrote:

I'm still unsure if the white is calcium or if the white is the lack of blue.
For example, here is a closeup of the blue and white. http://picturepush.com/public/8203361
The white on the tile must be a deposit of something. The blue below it must be the pool plaster. But what's the white below the blue?
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On Sat, 05 May 2012 18:02:01 -0500, gonjah wrote:

I think I'm getting closer to figuring it out.
Today I pressure washed the pool (water only).
At one point, I deliberately stayed in one spot. Guess what?
The pool plaster turned blue! http://picturepush.com/public/8204310
That implies the white stuff is on top of the blue stuff. If that's the case, then I need to figure out what the white stuff is.
Probably Calcium - but I'm just guessing. If it is calcium (it feels like sand), then I 'guess' the acid wash (muriatic acid) is what gets rid of that Calcium.
Is that correct?
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On 5/6/2012 11:05 PM, Arklin K. wrote:

Looks like some kind of coating.

I don't know. Monday will probably bring out more ideas.
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On Sun, 06 May 2012 23:14:29 -0500, gonjah wrote:

I'm beginning to think the pool was painted blue long ago. Then, over time, the deposits of X (calcium?) built up. The sides then turned, essentially, white.
Everywhere I kept the pressure hose, it turned darker blue ... so I think it's the underlying paint that's blue.

I guess the good news is that I can remove whatever the white stuff is. Everyone is assuming calcium - so I just have to figure out how to remove calcium scale in a pool.
If it's an acid wash, well, then that's that.
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