Water-based poly?

Hmm. So it's been almost 24 hrs since the last coat. Am I going to regret it if I add another coat 24-48 hrs after the last coat?

Reply to
Gary Fritz
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One thing to watch for is making too many layers with a semigloss finish. Each layer reduces the clarity and begins to hide the wood. Usually you do all the base coats with "clear" and then do the final satin coat with the satin or SG finish. I've only used the minwax stuff and have applied extra coats within minutes and sometimes weeks later. I would avoid any recoats in the 4-24 hour range since the surface is too dry for the next coat to adhere well and too soft to properly "scuff" it up. After 24 hours you can do whatever leveling sanding you need and apply another coat.

-Bruce

Reply to
BruceR

depends on the product. generally they recommend recoating pretty soon after it's dry to the touch. what's it say on the can?

depends on the product. some MFRs make satin by adding white powders to the finish. they cloud with build. some make satin other ways. enduro products for instance don't cloud with build.

Reply to
bridger

On 26 Oct 2004 15:26:56 GMT, Gary Fritz calmly ranted:

I make it a point NEVER to put on more than one coat of any finish ('cept shellac) within 24 hours. Giving the finish time to dry between coats is half its hardness factor, IMHO. And putting another coat on top of a gooey coat keeps the lower coat from hardening in a fair amount of time...if ever.

You're using a PLASTIC finish, so moisture removal is of utmost importance between coats. The upper coat could keep the bottom coat wet forever.

Reply to
Larry Jaques

acrylic polyurethanes are an exception to that rule. they do their final cure mostly by crosslinking rather than by drying. you're supposed to recoat soon after they are dry to touch. otherwise the layers won't bond well.

Reply to
bridger

On 26 Oct 2004 21:44:25 GMT, Gary Fritz calmly ranted:

Read the can and follow their suggestions unless you have personal experience with the product and know what you can get away with.

Reply to
Larry Jaques

Larry, WB finishes are designed to be recoated in a short time frame. Failure to do so can result in finish failure (adhesion issues).

David

Larry Jaques wrote:

Reply to
David

Wes, the crosslinker DOES harden the finish by a noticeable amount. I'm not sure it is the 7 times that they claim. :)

David

Wes Stewart wrote:

Reply to
David

Reply to
nospambob

Minwax's Polycrylic is not polyurethane and is much softer than traditional oil-based polyurethanes. Flecto's water-based Varathane is much harder than Polycrylic. I've used many gallons of Polycrylic on cabinets because I like the way it applies and settles, but I use Varathane on shelves for it's toughness.

They should be compatible. Sand the Polycrylic with 320 grit, then apply a coat or two of Varathane.

-Dave

Reply to
Dave Plumpe

No Gary, what I am saying is that if you continue to just add varnish in and attempt to level the low spots you could be at it for the next month.

Level out the finish to the level of the low spots caused by the open grain then add a coat or two.

Reply to
MikeG

Gack. Great.

Hmmm. OK. If I remember right it was a Varathane product that I used on the table 20 years ago.

If sanding with 320 will ensure bonding to the polycrylic, then I think I'll do that. Two coats (on top of 3 coats of the polycrylic?) will be enough? Or should I sand down most of the polycrylic so the varathane doesn't have a soft surface underneath it??

I definitely can't tolerate a soft finish from the polycrylic. This table gets used 2-4 times every day and it needs to stand up to wear.

Thanks, Gary

Reply to
Gary Fritz

No guarantees in life that I know of, Gary - sometimes we just have to take chances. I THINK Varathane should bond well to scuffed-up Polycrylic, but can't remember ever actually doing that.

Certainly, the less Polycrylic under the Varathane, the better, but what you suggest sounds good. If I had it to do, I'd probably sand down the Polycrylic until it's very thin, but not gone (I like the color of the first coat of Polycrylic better than Varathane), then apply 2-3 coats of glossy Varathane (sanding between coats, of course), followed by one coat of semi-gloss (I think that's the surface you wanted). Generally, you want to use gloss for all but the last coat because it's much clearer than semi-gloss or flat, but it depends on whether you think of your table as "fine furniture". The Varathane I use is for floors, specifically: "Varathane Crystal Clear Waterborne Diamond Wood Finish", "Floors".

-Dave

Reply to
Dave Plumpe

I guarantee this polycrylic would get trashed within a few months. :-\ I can easily gouge out pieces with my fingernail.

I sanded down the Polycrylic with 220. Much more than just "scuffing it up," but not down to the wood. Unfortunately this means the higher areas of the wood are glassy-smooth now, instead of having the interesting grain pattern I had before. Oh well.

This stuff is nasty to sand, at least with a fine grit. I had to stop every few minutes to scrape goobers of plastic off the sanding disk. The sanding dust feels more like fine plastic balls than like the silky-smooth dust you get from wood. Or even from the old Varathane.

I'm a bit concerned that the color seems a bit irregular now. I'm hoping that evens out when I apply the Varathane. I really don't want to have to start over and sand down to the wood again -- especially if this polycrylic is as nasty to sand with 40-grit as it was with 220 -- but if that's the right thing to do, I'll do it. Better to do it now before I put a couple of coats of Varathane on. I don't want to have to refinish this thing again for 15-20 years so I want to do it right.

Gary

Reply to
Gary Fritz

BTW I thought I didn't get down to the wood. It still feels like plastic in most areas. But e.g. there is a spot where I accidentally gouged the wood with the 40-grit, and I smoothed out a depression around it. Now that area shows a light ring around the depression. Not sure why that would be, if I haven't touched the wood & thus the stain. Maybe it will disappear when I apply the Varathane? Or maybe I got down to the wood in a few spots and removed some of the stain. If so, I probably ought to start over and take it down to the wood again.

***SIGH***
Reply to
Gary Fritz

Gary Fritz wrote in news:Xns959093D37E5A0fritzfriicom@216.17.128.40:

It sands better when it cures longer. The same reason you're trying to take it off is the reason the paper clogs.

Is there any way you can just leave it alone for a couple of weeks? Use another table, until this one cures?

The ingredient most often forgotten in the formula is patience. DAMHIKT.

Patriarch

Reply to
patriarch

Ick. We already have a temporary table but it's definitely a pain. I'm wondering if the 40-grit will take the polycrylic off without so much gunking-up. I might give it a try and see how it works so I can get this project DONE and get this big honkin' table (4 leaves, 10' long) off the floor & out of the way. If I waited a few weeks I'd at least get it off the floor, but I'd like to finish this.

What was that you said about patience?? :-)

When I take it down to the wood again -- this time should I use a filler before the Varathane? Or do you figure there's enough polycrylic in the low spots to take care of it already?

Reply to
Gary Fritz

OK, I got out the 60 grit (HD didn't have any 40) and took it down to the wood. Don't know whether it was another few days of curing, or the coarser grit, but it went much quicker and smoother than when I used the 220. No plastic melting, etc.

So I need to do passes with 150 and 220, but does anybody have any thoughts on wood filler? Should I just assume the deep grain pits are full of Polycrylic and don't worry about it? Didn't worry about it with the Polycrylic and it seemed OK.

Now I just gotta find the Varathane DWF Floors. HD didn't have it, and neither did the local Ace hardware (except one 4oz can of gloss). They had all kinds of Varathane products but not the DWF WB.

Gary

Reply to
Gary Fritz

This is why I gave up on the random orbital sanders - seemed like maybe some spot got clogged and *that* made the marks? Wasn't sure and the marks really stand out. I've noticed the same in some craft show work.

Josie

Reply to
firstjois

I went over it with 150 and 220, and got it to a glassy-smooth finish. But I apparently have troubles running my new random-orbit sander right.

The first time I did this, I found two small spots (after staining) that showed corkscrew sanding marks. I sanded them out by hand and restained over them, and they seemed OK.

This time, even though I was being extra-careful, I've got corkscrew marks all over the place. There must be at least 6-8 of them. And naturally you can't see them until you stain.

Am I doing something wrong here? Should I only use the random-orbit sander for rough sanding, removing material, etc, and use a regular sander for everything else? Except most of these marks probably came from the 40/60 grit, didn't they??

sigh

Reply to
Gary Fritz

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