Topcote v. Boeshield v. Paste Wax v. Shellac - Da Winnah!

[Tom Watson]

Some time back I posted some stuff about using a light bulb inside of machine cabinets to keep away rust.

It was an act of desperation.

Since that sucked, I decided to try other things.

In the past I've used paste wax (three coats and a buff), Topcote,and Boeshield. None of them were really satisfactory.

The problem is that they wear off too quickly and leave the cast iron open to rusting.

I had this idea that shellac might make a good barrier coat. It wouldn't wear as quickly as the others. It would be nice and slidey. It could be applied at least as quickly as the wax, although not so quickly as the sprays - but the spray sucked anyways.

So, I pinged O'Deen and asked him what he thought about the idea of wiping shellac onto the cast iron tops of my machinery.

Well, that's sorta like asking Billy Graham what he thinks about Jesus

- but, with the imprimatur of the Ayatollah of Shellackola - I proceeded with my testing.

I waxed the top of the shaper (three coats and a buff). I put Topcote on the Unisaur. I applied Boeshield to the Lion Miter Trimmer (have a devil of a time keeping rust off that thing and I'm scared to death of the blades - so a spray seemed a good way to go). I wiped on three coats of three pound cut shellac onto the jointah and the bandsaur (didn't buff - just de-nibbed wif 4/0 steel wool).

Well, the results are in. The shaper (wax) is showing a good deal of rust in the area around the opening that the cutters project through. The Unisaur (Topcote) shows the beginnings of rust - but it gets used the most and I think there would have been more if it were not used so much. The miter trimmer (Boeshield) shows no rust but the Boeshield was applied heavy and wet - the way you would for storage (but the topcote never kept the rust of it when applied this way)(also, the Unisaur has rusted before when I've used Boeshield that was wiped after application).

The jointah and the bandsaur show no rust at all.

Well, I'm going to try shellac on the other tools now. I don't see much downside. Ths stuff comes off readily when the alcohol is wiped on and it goes on fast with a cloth.

I figure I'll wipe the shellac off before putting on a fresh coating, so there will be no buildup.

Just right now I'm hopeful that shellac is the way to go.

ymmv

all other caveats apply.

Regards, Tom Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker Gulph Mills, Pennsylvania

[Rob Stokes]

Well now that's an interesting experiment, with interesting results. I'm curious how you fond the "action" of wood across the surface with the shellac and I'm curious as to how it will wear...I'd love to hear a running commentary on the results as time progress' Tom.

Rob

[Tom Watson]

As they say 'round these parts,the action is, "slickernsnot", and is comparable to the buffed wax. As to the wear; I'll know better when I start using it on the Unisaur and the shaper.

I should have mentioned that I was using a Dewaxed Extra Pale shellac from Homestead Finishing. I don't know that the Extra Pale has much to do with it but the Dewaxed is thought to provide a better moisture/vapor barrier than its waxier brethren.

I'm excited by the shellac idea because I know that it will not introduce negative chemistry into the wood, which is worrisome to me regarding the Boeshield and Topcote (and a bit with the wax).

I was concerned that the shellac would tend to tear or flake off under abrasion and pressure but that has not proven to be the case with the Jointah - the Bandsaur doesn't provide much of a test in that regard.

I like the early results enough to begin using the shellac on all of my cast iron and see how that plays out.

If there are significant results - I'll be sure to post them.

Regards, Tom Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker Gulph Mills, Pennsylvania

[Larry Jaques]

On Sat, 29 Nov 2003 21:32:28 GMT, Tom Watson brought forth from the murky depths:

3 coats of wax is prolly 2 too many. The next coat dissolves the first, so you really only have one coat on there.

My tools, with ALL THEIR USE (?) have shown little rust over the past year since I waxed 'em.

Bzzzzt! Denibbing wears the shellac off any bumps, effectively leaving no finish on those areas. They might rust.

Maybe you should just wax things every month or two? Or shellac now and wax monthly?

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[Doug Winterburn]

[snip]

The real solution is to move to a dry climate, namely Arizona. Then, I could become your endentured servant and in return explain that "golf thing" to you. You did say you weren't "that" Tom?

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[David F. Eisan]

Tom,

I have bought a couple of used machines that the tables looked impeccable on, only on closer inspection to find that they have been sprayed with clear lacquer. These have all been big industrial machines from factories. My 20" Wadkin bandsaw table (130lb+) was clearcoated, I only discovered this when I scratched it. I wonder why more people don't simply clearcoat?

Thanks,

David.

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[Tom Watson]

Wrong.

No shit.

Wrong again.

How's that bowsaw coming along?

Regards, Tom Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker Gulph Mills, Pennsylvania

[Tom Watson]

Yep. The only reason I didn't use lacquer was that I didn't want to have to use lacquer thinner to strip it if it got messed up.

(also, the shellacky is supposed to provide a better vapor barrier than lacquer, from what I've read.)

I hope this works. It would save me a lot of time.

Regards, Tom Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker Gulph Mills, Pennsylvania

[J Pagona aka Y.B.]

While I'm interested in hearing how the shellac works long term, I'll put in my own two cents on what works for me hear in humid, damp, wet Florida. I use a coat of Boeshield, and once it dries, I cover it with a coat of wax. I do this only once a year, give or take 3 or 4 months. This has kept my tools virtually rust free for the last 5 years (absent any really stupid moves on my part like leaving a piece of green oak on the bandsaw table). I do have to admit that my tools probably don't see quite as much use as Tom's tablesaw.

BTW, Tom, plenty of neanders use wax on the bottom of their metal planes to cut down on the friction when in use, and I have never heard of it interfering with a finish. No scientific study, just a casual observation. David

remove the key to email me.

[Tom Watson]

I'll agree that Florida's air is usually juicier than Pennsyltucky air but I wonder if the temperature of your equipment falls below the dew point any more frequently than mine does here in my shop (that is in a hollow, twenty feet from a stream).

I've had a devil of a time keeping rust off the cast iron in this shop and that's why I've tried so many possible solutions. I've not tried the Boeshield and wax treatment but might, if the shellac idea doesn't pan out. The wax alone does not work for me. Despite Lorry Jax's protestations to the contrary, three coats is better than one (cf Forest Products Laboratory, General Tech Report, FPL-GTR-113,

1999.)but, even after three coats the MEE (Moisture Excluding Effectiveness) is only 17%, while three coats of nitro lacquer is 79% and three coats of shellac is 91% (it is not clear whether the tested shellac was de waxed or not).

Yeah, I use it myself - and my planes get rusty. I figure the wax is not a contamination problem once it's dry and buffed. I've had some problems in the past when I've been sloppy in wiping the wax off the Unisaw and left little gobs of it in the plough or around the edge. The wax creates a problem under lacquer finishes.

Regards, Tom Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker Gulph Mills, Pennsylvania

[Swingman]

My bet it that as long as you can keep the shellac slick, for ease of use, it should work. Got a nice coat of overspray on a rarely used spare drill press table top a couple of months back and just left it ... no ill effects and no rust thus far.

[Mark & Juanita]

One thought regarding the shellac, doesn't shellac melt at body temperature? If one were to lean on a tool, for example, leaning on the table saw with one hand while making adjustments or reaching down for to retrieve a dropped arbor nut (I know, professionals never drop that nut), is is possible that you could melt through the finish?

[CROQ]

impeccable

Has anyone considered powder coating?

Back to lurking. C

[Larry Jaques]

On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 10:14:46 GMT, Tom Watson brought forth from the murky depths:

I'm from Missouri. Show me.

How can sanding (light, but sanding nonetheless) NOT remove the finish on the high spots?

I saw the parts box earlier this year, thanks.

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[Tom Watson]

Guess you'll have to move.

"MEE (Moisture Excluding Effectiveness) of "Paste Furniture Wax": One Coat = 6%; Two Coats = 11%; Three Coats = 17%."

(Forest Products Laboratory, General Tech Report, FPL-GTR-113,

1999.)

If you can't knock off the dust and nibs without taking off the finish, you need to take a good look at your technique - or maybe you should switch to 4/0 steel wool from whatever you're using.

Regards, Tom Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker Gulph Mills, Pennsylvania

[Nova]

According to a Google search the melting point of waxed shellac is somewhere between 77 C and 90 C (170 F - 194 F). The melting point for dewaxed shellac would be higher.

-- Jack Novak Buffalo, NY - USA (Remove "SPAM" from email address to reply)

[nospam]

hey, Tom- that's an interesting sounding report you cite. do ya know if it's available online, and if so do you have a link for us?

I have tried linseed oil, with no bad effects. I've never tried shellac or laquer. I live in Arizona, so it's not usually a huge problem here. paste wax seems to do fine for me.... Bridger

[Tom Watson]

Regards, Tom Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker Gulph Mills, Pennsylvania

[Charlie Self]

Jack Novak responds:

So, basically, it seems if you're warm enough to melt shellac, you're also warm enough that it doesn't make a bit of difference to you.

Charlie Self

"Say what you will about the ten commandments, you must always come back to the pleasant fact that there are only ten of them." H. L. Mencken

[Swingman]

IIRC, mechanical action and enzymes in the digestive system can dissolve a nail, so a shellac coated pill should be a comparative piece of cake ... literally.