It is well documented that the worker is the single most expensive cost to
production. Not only does the employeer have to pay higher wages, if there
is still a retirement plan that costs the employeer more, social security
costs the employeer mor, and insurance costs the employeer more to name a
That is influnced by the share holders an entirely different aspect.
Perhaps if the American worker got paid what he was really worth the jobs
would still be here.
Absolutely not. I retired at 40, 10 years ago making a respectable salery.
For the last 10 years I have been self employeed and make about 1/3 of my
previous salary. I knew that going in and have no problem with that.
Additionally I live within my meens and am debt free. If you have a brain
and money sence you can get by with a compeditive salary.
Found this when searching on router bits... still couldn't find
Whiteside's own website homepage. Do you know the Whiteside URL?
"It is Whiteside's policy to provide you with the best possible Router
Bits. Superior Quality, American-made Router Bits - Not the Imported
tooling many of our competitors sell out of a U.S. supply house. These
competitors down-play the fact that their tools are imported. Their
catalogs leave out the country of origin for their product. Their names
sound American. Some even add "USA" to their company name. On the other
hand, Whiteside Tools are MADE IN THE USA. Whiteside Tools more than
measure up to the competition. In addition, we are here in the U.S. to
help you with our years of experience. We are here in the U.S. to provide
technical support. We are here in the U.S. to provide custom tooling if
the job demands it. We sell exclusively through qualified distributors
who know something about woodworking and can offer additional support.
Finally, we stand behind our product. If you haven't used a Whiteside
router bit, we invite you to give us a try."
Must say I have not tried whiteside bits ,I but quite a few from highland
hardware which is local for me .Many of thier bits are Amana whitch as far
as I know are US made . I am originally from the UK and know many quality
manufacturers have been taken over by various european consortiums and
generally as I see it most times with a loss of quality in the never ending
quest for more profits .There are few exceptions ,perhaps fords initial
input to Jaguare and definately bmw's imput to the "mini".
As far as carbide is concerned anyone can make quality stuff American asians
you name it . Of course the asians can afford to make quality carbide bits
and make them cheaper simply because of their lower production costs .
However those costs eventually fade dueto higher standards of living and the
consequence of higher aspirations ,take a look at China for instance, a
total metamorphosis in the last 20 years .......mjh
I guess you got me corrected. Yes, it would be that way...
I am trying to compare and analyze different router bits. From just
looking at the shelf, the CMT would win me. Freud has many good reports.
From what I gather somewhat "best bang for buck", Freud would be it. But
for only few dollars more, CMT would then be gotten. I am not asking
"what is the best router bit" because it's going to be full of opinion. I
did read a review about bits, but it was mainly with straight cuts, not
I still can not find a store where they sell Freud bits? Must be ordered
online? Tomorrow, I am going to Lowies for first time (new store in my
town) to see if they sell Freud. I remember from WW show, there's a brand
called Viper, comments?
Rockler tells me if ANYTHING goes wrong with the Rockler bit, bring it
back to the store. Of course, I mention "wear?" and they said it depends,
but bring it back, we will see about it then. They also have another
brand bits next to the Rockler brand, I THINK it's Amana, boy it's
expensive (talking about TWICE as much), but I am buying router bits to
use it, not for show-and-tell.
I still don't know what is Freud 2+2, except 2+2 obvious would be 4, huh?
It's a $200 investment, except $250 for CMT. I am interested in "3-set".
Oldham makes Viper. I bought some when I got my first router, but
haven't purchased any more. They are OK, sort of, but they are locked
up under glass at Home Depot (reasonable), and you have to find a tool
person with a key and 4 minutes to actually purchase anything (less
The reason to buy Amana is for the doing, not the show & tell. Their
selection will be wider, and they will be in the specialty bits that
Rockler doesn't sell in the blue line.
Check your local directory and see if you can find an
industrial/commercial sharpening service that caters to cabinet shops
and the like. Or call a local shop, and see who sells them their bits.
My local guy has a wide selection of Whiteside on hand, and the tooling
to resharpen them on site. The cabinet door set I bought from him,
locally, with tax, was a bunch lower than what you're quoting, everyday.
Ask them about band saw blades while you're there, and see about
sharpening or replacing your table saw blade, before you cut into that
$1000 stack of kitchen cabinet materials. You might just save the cost
of the router bits in one visit.
Keep asking questions. That kitchen will get itself done by Labor Day.
;-) Take some pictures along the way. It makes the bragging easier,
when folks tell you how good it looks.
You might just share here, too. Guys like Swingman, who have been doing
this a while, still like showing off their craftsmanship, even after
many dozens of kitchens. That's a good thing, and inspiration to most
Not easily done from reading specifications on some, but not given on
others. There are different types of carbide and the better grades hold a
better edge for a longer time. If you look here
http://www.ridgecarbidetool.com/html/custom.htm you will see they have
different grades for different mateials to be cut.
If you look here http://www.infinitytools.com/departments.asp?dept 01
you will see similar specifications. They also mention the bearing quality,
Both are good bits. As are others.
Ver true. I use a few different bands and have my favorites. I'ms ure there
are many good brands that I have not tried.
I've seen them in stores. IIRC, Sears had some. Lowes is not the place to
look for quality bits. Or for a good selection.
Nice to know. How about the wood that gets ruined though?
Yes, it is. Amana is good too. They are for use in pro shops, not for show.
I have some $5 bits from Woodcraft. They are very good for what I use them
for, but they are not anywhere near the quality of the top brands. I'd not
trust them to use on anything expensive or complex. I have Whiteside,
Infinity, Freud, Jesada, Lee Valley. If I was doing raised panels, fancy
edges, I'd stick with the more expensive, known high quality brands. I'd
not try to save a few $ and risk $50 in wood and hours of time. Tough to
put that into the equation for best bang for the buck.
Good luck with your choice. Best bang is different for the home shop that
will make a profile on 4' of wood and put it aside for a year or three
versus cutting hundreds of feet of high priced exotic wood.
How long do you expect to use a router bit. They flat do not last forever.
In my opinion that must be considered. Sharpening, I don't know about that.
A little proper honing done correctly is ok. But sharpening would depend on
the thickness of the carbide.
Also hard means brittle and thus chipping as mentioned. I personally say
away from the real hard carbide.....
Ask your sawblade sharpening service about resharpening router bits, and
let that help guide your decisions.
Mine sells and sharpens Whiteside, focused at the commercial market. If
you have to send them 'out', the economics shift somewhat.
I think it would be possible to reach consensus on the attributes that
make up a quality router bit. Not sure if anyone's done that yet. But
seems to me there would be columns in the Excel spreadsheet that talk
about aspects of the carbide, the shank, the bearing, the coating, etc.
Then you could try to weight the columns and then objectively assign
scores to each column for each bit. Do some arithmetic and determine
Me? I think that would be overanalyzing.
I'd try two other approaches:
(1) what do other, ostensbily impartial, parties think?
Or (2) - assume there's some significant correlation between quality and
price due the a variety of factors, including the number of players in
the market. Then let your budget be the guide.
I have a few Rockler's, one Woodline, one PC, a couple CMT. The rest are
Whiteside and Infinities.
Frankly, I think my technique is still worse that the bit - said another
way, any problems I have are likely my fault, not due to the bit.
Recently Rockler opened up in North Atlanta, I went their looking for
hardware last week and to check on the sale of Ashley Isles carving tools .
Regarding the latter they probably are trying to find a cheaper source .
Personally I found generally their quality did not impress me in the least .
As far as hardware is concerned ,and as far as an american quality small
business goes horton brasses in cromwell conn is very hard to beat . Over
the last 30 years I have delt with them they have done nothing but get
better and better...mjh
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