Re: Biesemeyer vs Unifence

The OP asked the advantages of one over the other. Having used both, there is only one distinct _advantage_ of one over the other in my estimation/experience for most wooddorker's:

The Beis, out of the box, is easier to "jig up".

What a salesman trying to make a sales says should be taken with a grain of salt, as most everything else is arguably subjective and a matter of personal preference.

As I stood between them side by side set up at various shows here is the pitch:

"they are the two best fence systems and you can't go wrong with either one of them.

The Unifence is more featured. You can (as I frantically demo) unlock the fence extrusion and pull it back to use your scale as a miter gage cut off block. You can (more frantic demo) pull the fence off and turn it 90 degrees to use the short leg to do the first side trim on laminated pieces with the laminate overhanging the fence. You can(additional demo, less frantic), use the new flip stops to have permenant set ups if you need to come back to certain rip lengths. You can move it from side to side (When asked about the bies capability to fence from both sides) very simply. You have both lateral and perp adjustment easily at your fingertips with supplied wrenches hanging on the unit.

The Biese, on the other hand is a Bulldog. Heavy steel tube and angle construction, no aluminum components, with hand shimmed laminate covered baltic birch on the fence faces. Easy to attach all manner of jigs, sacrificial blocks, and feather boards and the like to the fence faces.

I always advised heavy production board slammin operations to go for the Biese and all others just have a difficult choice that won't matter once they get what they choose.

My $.02 worth

Frank

The biggest dislike I have for the Uni is having to change the position of the fence rail to cut from the other side of the blade. Granted this not a problem very often but with the Uni you have to unscrew the fence rail and mount it on the other side. Then when you have finished with that one cut, you have to move it back. Normally I'd stand there looking at it trying to figure out how to make the cut without changing the fence.....and then change it anyway.:-)

Mike O.

Frank Boettcher wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

I wish to thank eveyone for their opinions regarding this matter. I think that I will opt for the Unifence. I will take the $100 I save and use it toward a mobile base. My saw and fence dates back to the 1940's and is a bit tough to read now for a variety of reasons.

Thanks again eveyone!!!!

Pierce

It even goes one step further down the line than that- I've used Beismeyers fairly extensively for work, but I've got the Delta T2 (if you're not familiar with it, think of it as a Beis-light) While it's a little narrower, I haven't found it to be inadequate in any way, or even noticably different than the Beis in "feel" or accuracy. My original thought was that I would get the saw as it was at the tool store, and then upgrade the fence later when I had some more ready cash, and after using it, I can't see any reason to shell out another $400 for the marginal upgrade.

Prometheus wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

Speaking of the T2, I had the opportunity to mess with that fence while at Lowes the other day and was not impressed. When locked in place I could move the far side laterally with moderate effort. I tried to see if there was a lock for the far end but could not see that there was one. Is there a lock for the far side?

Nope- no lock for the far side, but I haven't noticed any problem with lateral deflection, and I've played with it quite a lot. AFAIK, there isn't a lock on the backside of a Beis. either, though that may be a side-effect of only seeing them installed on saws with outfeed tables. It's important to note that the display models are often beaten up quite a bit by people doing things like intentionally pushing the back side to see they can move it, and other impromtu stress tests. Add that to sloppy assembly by the store in the first place, and even a great tool can end up looking like a POS. Took a look at my saw at Farm and Fleet today, and if I'd have gone off from what it looks like there, I would have never bought it. It was bright and shiny when I bought mine- but the top is now covered in rust, and everything is loose and looks like it has been beaten with a hammer. But that's the display model- mine is still nice and shiny (waxed weekly) and everything is still tip-top, even though I use it a lot.

I guess my point is not that the Beis isn't a better fence- it is made of a wider steel tube, but that the T2 is pretty good as well (beat-up old display models at Lowes aside) and it sure doesn't feel like it's worth $400 less than the Beis. My plan was to get a Unisaw with the Beismeyer fence when I got the 36-680, but something came up (as it always will) and took a bite out of the tool budget. I was expecting to be disappointed in the contractor's saw with the lighter fence- but I'm not. It's really a pretty good saw, even comparing it to the Caddilac that is the Unisaw- and for a price tag that is almost $1000 smaller.

The Bies ONLY locks at the front... Thats why it is refered to as a "T" square type of fence...and honestly I will NEVER ever go back to fences that lock both front and back...simply because they can "sometimes" lock down out of square....

The Bottom line is that if your fence "works" and it does not give you any problems there is no reason to upgrade to another...

At places like Lowes and Home Depot the display models usually are assembled by some kid... who is more concerned with getting off work so he can run home and get ready for his "hot" date that evening... (nothing wrong with that been there myself a long long time ago)

Enjoy Bob G.

Your comment is irrational considering there's pros and cons to both types of fences.. *Any* fence can lock down out of square if it's not setup properly. I've got an Excalibur fence that locks down both sides and the fact that it locks down both sides allays any fears of fence deflection when running large heavy pieces of wood along the fence.

I upgraded from a Delta contractor's table saw with Delta's standard fence to a Delta Unisaw with a Beisemeyer fence. I like the fence. My only disappointment was no adjustment to make fence face perpendicular to the table. It was at about 87 or 88 degrees out of the box. I ended up putting a some tape under one of the glides on the T square to tip it to 90 degrees. I know there are other ways to mickey mouse it into being square or one could just live with it, but at the cost of the fence, it just seems like they could easily put an nylon adjustment screw on each side of the T-square to get this done. Even the cheaper clones and the lower grade fence that came with my contractor's saw have that..

Are you sure? My Bies had allen screws to adjust it to square. . .

BB

There are allen screws to get the fence square to the fence rails. However, the fence can still be out of square to the top of the table.

Some Biesmeyer clones also have a second set of allen screws to adjust the angle of the fence faces relative to the table top. The name-brand Bies doesn't have these.

Chris

I have a Bies with a 5HP LT Unisaw - never had a problem - sounds like one needs to make sure that the fence rail is mounted correctly on the table - if that is done then there is no need to worry about fence faces.

BB

When I go into a Lee Valley store, I'm always eyeing the HTC Bies clone. It has a micro-adjustment feature with magnifier for exact measurement. Do most other Bies clones including the original have the fine adjustment?

I have the HTC fence with a Jet label.

The micro-adjuster is a nice feature when it's needed. In my opinion the magnifier is a PITA.

Think about it - if the rails are not true to the table, they are going to be off by a consistent angle across their length. It would not require two sets of adjustments to make this error correct, only one. True the fence to the blade and it's done. If the fence is true to the blade, nothing else matters. If the rails were to be off by a varying angle across their length you'd have bigger problems than any number of set screws will ever fix.

We're talking about adjustments in two planes.

The first set of screws allows you to set the fence parallel to the blade.

The second set of screws found on some fences allows to you ensure that the face of the fence is perpendicular to the table.

Assuming the fence is in good shape, this second set should never be needed. I expect that some of the clones have this second set in order to allow the end-user to adjust out errors in the construction process. It could also allow to realign things if the short "T" section of the fence got bent from a fall or some similar form of damage.

Chris

My bad. That's what I get for jumping in mid-stream, huh?