I've been there 18 years. I've known the owners for well over 20 and we
worked together at another company. There has never been a layoff. We have
18 employees and use a temp service for production when needed. The
building we were in had a fire and shut us down, but no one missed an hour
of pay. Even when we had no production for 5 months while moving to our
Our section of the building did not burn, be we had to move out anyway.
Employee age ranges from 72 down to 22. We have few rules, but the most
important is "get the job done". As long as we are shipping on time, making
a profit and keeping customers happy, there is very few questions asked. We
all have the same goal as we all share in the benefits. Profit sharing,
401k, good medical, even free coffee.
Don't ask me how much vacation time I get. I don' tknow. I just take off
whatever time I need. Don't ask me what my hours are either. For the
longest time I started at 8 but now I go in roughly at 7 and leave about
four, unless I leave at 2. Or unless I go out during the day to get an oil
change. I don't consider going to work "work". No plans to retire.
Definitely not UTC. Stay an hour late and your supervisor gets mad at
you for making him look bad because he hadn't stayed late. There's
some vice president taking names of people who come in 5 minutes late,
but he's not taking names of people who go home five _hours_ late.
Get explicit orders to piss off the customer. Never met the owners,
who are a bunch of anonymous shareholders.
Yes, some people went to law school to become a public defender. A public
defender doesn't do that bad. I knew many true believers that had that
career in mind and many more whom studied for degrees in social work.
Another high paying job, but not as good as public defender.
I don't understand people that pleasure in putting down others that had
the initiative take charge of their lives. Student loans are loans and
should be repaid. Bitching about repaying them is the same as bithing
about repaying your mortgage. Credit card debt for a student is pure
You may not see this since you plonked me some time ago.
Think about it. HE did it, SHE didn't. Difference is attitude. She was
out to make a case for eternal poverty, he out to make a case for
Don't let your prejudices get in the way, or you might miss something.
It's news because in our John Edward's two-Americas paradigm, it is held
by most enlightened elites that the working poor in our society are
chronically in that condition with no way out of their condition without
the help of the government taking away money from other productive people
and giving it to those working poor or through legislation that forces
businesses to pay them more or provide free career education or some other
What this guy did just set that paradigm on its ear. He showed that by
applying common sense and rationality to this condition, he was able to
start with nothing and move up.
Yeah, that's news.
If you're going to be dumb, you better be tough
The free market provides the best mechanism for price valuation. It is
also a zero sum game. Market economies tend to be implemented by
democracies. Market losers are also voters. The entitlements about
which you whine serve as preservation for the market system. It's
telling that EVERY market economy also has an entitlements programs.
Populist insurrections are easily placated with scraps. The US has the
stingiest entitlements program among advanced western economies. If
you don't like them, then this is the country for you.
I'm certainly not going to solve the problem of institutional poverty
in a usenet post but it seems your paradigm toppling relies on an
assumption that probably doesn't reflect reality.
I'm not sure why people are impressed by this "experiment." For one
thing, it doesn't reflect conditions AND it needs a control. In the
first trial, Adam Shepard carried 25.00, a gym bag AND a college
education. In other words, that was a control run. Now we may conduct
an experiment that reflects actual condition. In the next trial, we'll
need to induce addiction and send Mr. Shepard onto the street in need
of a fix AND material well-being. In the third trial, we'll damage
part of his brain in order to create a mental disability. I'll
withhold judgement until the experiment is complete.
But--addiction is a self-inflicted disability. While it would be nice to say
that we want addicts as well as sociopaths, psycopaths and the mentally ill
to have a "place at the table", it is also unrealistic. All the college
education, counseling and social programs in the world are NOT going to help
those unwilling or uncapable of utilizing them. What Adam Shepard did was
show that a reasonably intelligent and motivated individual CAN pick himself
up from nothing. Nothing world shaking there--I've done it myself, and so
have several previous posters on this thread.
Wasn't it John Edwards who said he wanted everyone in America to have above
> > It's news because in our John Edward's two-Americas paradigm, it is
Hmmm. I'm not sure what institutional poverty is, but I do remember what
poverty was. I wonder where I fit in to your control groups. I certainly
wasn't a college graduate with a gym bag and twenty-five dollars although
I could make as much as sixty to sixty-five dollars a week picking
tobacco during the summer (actually I only made that much during the
fifth and sixth picks which lasted about two weeks. The rest of the time
I made twenty to thirty-five dollars a week). Pretty good pay for a high
school kid. The rest of the year I made about twenty bucks a week after
school. My pay always went to my mother to help support my brother and
sister (my brother worked also, but my sister was too young). My father
was a very unsuccessful burgler and we hadn't seen him since I was about
six or seven. I wasn't addicted to anything except girls. So I guess I
am/was brain damaged. I was asked to leave high school at sixteen. I was
somewhat of an asshole at that time (probably still am), but a
hardworking asshole. I got my first full time job, at one dollar and ten
cents an hour, running drying machines at a diaper service. This was
minimum wage plus ten percent. I decided during that period that I was
not going to be poor and I'm not.
TCM occasionally shows an old film which has a similar theme. That of
a privledged man pretending to be down on his luck for the purpose of
getting a handle on the attitudes of the less fortunate. The film was
set during the depression and featured Joel McRae and Veronica Lake (I
guess that date me). Its worth catching the next time TCM broadcasts
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