Straw Poll "Are you satisfied with hot water from a combi boiler"

[Doctor Drivel]

I am Dr Drivel for certain. Now button up your cardigan.

[timegoesby]

Thanks for the explanation. I'm sold on paper anyhow. I'll leave the "gang" alone, as all I got was negative responses, and not one ounce of objectivity.

I think this thread deserves a poem. :-)

[timegoesby]

I see why you are so agressive when stainless steel is mentioned.

[Andy Hall]

Only one product can, by definition, have the fastest recovery available of any cylinder. That was the question and the request for justification.

As far as the technology is concerned, there are several ways for one tank in tank to have better performance than another. For example, the surface area between tanks can be increased by using a fluted rather than a purely cylindrical surface.

So you believe that they are all the same?

I suppose that if you were to cut through one supporting the cold storage tank, you could create one of your floods even faster than abusing plastic plumbing.

No, because you can store usable water at 65 degrees and mix it with cold for use.

The 380 litres of the ACV is at 45 degrees.

The formula for resultant temperature of mixing water is

Vc[Tf - Tc] = Vh[Th - Tf]

Where upper case V=volume T=temperature and lower case h=hot, c=cold and f=final

e.g. for 380 litres of 45 degree water - using 10 degrees for the cold as ACV have done

[380-Vh] * 35 = Vh * 20

13300 - (35*Vh) = Vh * 20

13300 = 55 * Vh

Vh = 240 litres

A 240 litre cylinder would be 1750mm high on a 450mm diameter footprint.

The ACV is the same height on a 600 x 650mm footprint so is larger.

There's nothing to make up other than to point out that the specs are not chosen for operating conditions that happen in the winter.

Massively late and massively overbudget. Great reference.....

... and then picked the best numbers.

The realistic ones are considerably less.

The trouble for you is that I can very easily. Sorry to burst your bubble.

Not particularly, but having measured water temperatures in various properties in February, I know that 5 degrees is entirely possible.

170kg implies 85kg each for two people or 57kg each for three.

I am not sure that the HSE would consider these to be safe lifting weights

[Matt]

Drivel, I've never had a bad word to say about stainless EVER.

Get back to that counter, you can have a 30 minute break at 12:30 until then keep selling more copper tanks and make me even richer.

A hacksaw in the bin is worth two in the hands of a homicidal part time plumbing counter assistant with a length of plastic pipe.

[Matt]

Dribble you must stop replying to yourself like this, the men in white coats will take you away to a land with no hacksaws, no leaflets to read and a 40 second combi fed shower once a week flowing 0.3 litres a minute at 21 deg C.

[Matt]

Totally irrelevant to anyone supplied with water stored in huge surface reservoirs and totally irrelevant to anyone fed by a borehole deeper than 100m.

Your exceptions Dribble ARE the norm.

Back to work, you can have a break in 15 mins.

[Matt]

.....and timegoesby when you use your other two neurons

[Owain]

She's more man than you'll ever be, sunshine.

Owain

[Dave Plowman (News)]

So all you want is confirmation of your views? Do this with John via e-mail and save us all the Drivel.

Like John, you appear not to actually understand figures - and what's more important to be able to interpret them. Ie, what they mean in practice rather than a maker's advertising claims.

[timegoesby]

I don't expect any objective comment from you then. ;-)

[Matt]

Nothing wrong with stainless either Drivel - I get free holidays from them too ;-) I always refuse the numerous free holidays from Combi only companies to preserve my integrity - the other month one of them even tried to tempt me with white water rafting in the Kalahari.

[Andy Hall]

Only one product can, by definition, have the fastest recovery available of any cylinder. That was the question and the request for justification.

As far as the technology is concerned, there are several ways for one tank in tank to have better performance than another. For example, the surface area between tanks can be increased by using a fluted rather than a purely cylindrical surface.

So you believe that they are all the same?

I suppose that if you were to cut through one supporting the cold storage tank, you could create one of your floods even faster than abusing plastic plumbing.

No, because you can store usable water at 65 degrees and mix it with cold for use.

The 380 litres of the ACV is at 45 degrees.

The formula for resultant temperature of mixing water is

Vc[Tf - Tc] = Vh[Th - Tf]

Where upper case V=volume T=temperature and lower case h=hot, c=cold and f=final

e.g. for 380 litres of 45 degree water - using 10 degrees for the cold as ACV have done

[380-Vh] * 35 = Vh * 20

13300 - (35*Vh) = Vh * 20

13300 = 55 * Vh

Vh = 240 litres

A 240 litre cylinder would be 1750mm high on a 450mm diameter footprint.

The ACV is the same height on a 600 x 650mm footprint so is larger.

There's nothing to make up other than to point out that the specs are not chosen for operating conditions that happen in the winter.

Massively late and massively overbudget. Great reference.....

... and then picked the best numbers.

The realistic ones are considerably less.

The trouble for you is that I can very easily. Sorry to burst your bubble.

Not particularly, but having measured water temperatures in various properties in February, I know that 5 degrees is entirely possible.

170kg implies 85kg each for two people or 57kg each for three.

I am not sure that the HSE would consider these to be safe lifting weights

[Doctor Drivel]

Lunatic. Stainless and combis are replacing copper. Hopefully you will be out of a job soon.

[Doctor Drivel]

So you are guessing as usual.

[Doctor Drivel]

You are thick at times. I said that once below a certain depth the temp is always the same. "No" seasonal changes, always the same. You could get a large coil of 32mm MDPE pipe, take it off the mains and bury it as deep as possible in the garden. Constant mains temp all the time.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Wouldn't you need two - one for each combi?

[Matt]

Shows how out of touch you are Dribble. All those leaflets and you fail to see the big picture.

Combi's went out with the ark. The Japanese can't get enough of our copper tanks and the Rinnai's are being carted off for landfill in their thousands. Storage IS the future, sad for you but true.

[Matt]

No it isn't. Do you know the consequences of "bury it as deep as possible in the garden" are ?

Do you know at what temperature the MDPE will fail?

Thought not. Back to the drawing board Dribble

[John Rumm]

Apparently not:

45kg would be a considered a "two man lift" - so 170kg will need mechanical lifting if it all comes in one lump.