Re: Electric and Hybrid Cars

[Andy Burns]

But they can top up with petrol "instantly" if they need to.

[JohnP]

Theo wrote in news:Eoy* [e-mail]:

Very true - a way of giving automatic transmission, in effect.

[The Natural Philosopher]

More like CVT - essentially you try to run the engine at peak efficiency, or not at all. And hope that that, plus the regen braking, ups the fuel economy.

[polygonum_on_google]

Though the engine in at least some Toyota hybrids does not always run at a single speed. The Atkinson cycle engines do speed up considerably for bette r acceleration. (That is the "try" bit!)

The effect of regen can be very significant. A change of driving style to a nticipate speed changes and keep within the regen capability can increase f uel economy very noticeably.

One journey I drive quite regularly, and the road is usually fairly quiet s o not much affected by having to adjust for other vehicles, I usually get a round 60 mpg in one direction and 70 in the other. Despite the destination being about 100 metres lower altitude.

[The Natural Philosopher]

I have managed to get my jag up from 28mpg to 35mpg by simply 'lifting and coasting' up to the corners and not using the brakes.

No regen needed :-)

[T i m]

Yeah, they do seem to use a disparate mix, everything from massive sign written vans to what looks like people in their own cars?

The other strange thing (other than to people in the know I suspect) is that a marked Prime van delivers to next door in the morning and an unmarked vehicle delivers another Prime (next day) delivery to me a bit later on?

'Logistics' eh. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

p.s. A mate was a HGV driver then Transport Manager for a company for some time when 'upper management' decided to update the dispatching and route planning software, I believe so that 'they' could get better stats and reports.

A process that used to take a few seconds then went to *hours* with the result of having many drivers and their vehicles sat in the yard. This carried on for quite some time with them reverting to the 'old system' and the workers (loaders / drivers) own (load / route) knowledge to keep them in business!

I think he left that company (or they actually went down the pan) before the whole dispatching software solution was as efficient (at it's primary task) as the old stuff was.

[Dave Liquorice]

B-) It's possible to coast (in neutral(*)) all the way town (2 miles) from here provided you get to 60+ at the start of the decent. You do get a bit slow (

[charles]

but that won't help with an "emergency stop".

[Dave Liquorice]

Presumably the higher mpg is when you're going up? Such a variation is to be expected as you are having to add "potential energy" to the car to get it up the hill.

Re-gen braking just recovers some of that potential energy when you descend rather than dumping it into the brakes as heat. A conventional car will also have a lower mpg on the decent but none of the potential energy will be recovered. It'll all be dumped as heat in the brakes and/or in the engine under engine braking.

See other post about coasting. Down to town in gear the instant mpg is 99+ for a lot of the time, comeing back up and getting the revs/gear right on the (very narrow) peak I can push the mpg up to about 26 mpg, normally low 20's and down to nearer 10 for the steep bits.

[polygonum_on_google]

No - the better MPG is coming back - which is, overall, uphill.

If I drive in a very similar manner in an ordinary petrol engine car, I can not get the MPG to rise as markedly. With care, I can get, maybe, 45 to 50 MPG on the same journey. Yes, of course, it is better than when driven hard . Both vehicles have MPG displays and you see the hybrid going up significa ntly during the downhill sections, and slowing for lower speed zones, but t he ordinary petrol doesn't show such a marked difference.

The non-hybrid has a 1400 turbo, the hybrid has a 1500.

(With even greater care, I have managed 79.9 on the return part of that tri p in the hybrid. But that was when the roads were very quiet and I positive ly tried to achieve a good MPG. Still trying to break 80 - but too much tra ffic at present to do so without holding up other people.)

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Eh? There are some electric only ones - not hybrids.

[Theo]

Depending on how long you spend at the destination, having a warm engine can help the MPG on the way back. The Gen2 (and maybe Gen1) Prius put the oil in something approximating a Thermos flask when you're stationary to try and keep it warm for longer. I think they dropped that in the Gen3 as it wasn't really worth it, but it might give a slight boost.

I've had 80+ for about 30 miles on the motorway. However that's slightly misleading in that the engine was already warm - I filled up immediately before joining the motorway which reset the MPG gauge. And I stayed behind a lorry the whole time, so wind resistance was reduced.

Theo

[Dave Liquorice]

Pheasant ambling across road will decide when 3/4's away across that it's a good idea to U turn and dash back to the safty of the nearside when you are less than 20 yards from it.

Lamb one side of the road ewe the other. Lamb will dash across the road to mum at the last moment.

Young rabbits play chicken, who will be the last to dash across in front of you, from either side of the road.

Adult rabbits run like f*ck along the road then execute an instant 90 degree turn into cover.

Hares run like f*ck along the road but don't have the cornering abilty or sense of rabbits. They'll meander about a bit, making passing risky. In daylight they will eventually turn off the road. Headlights really onfuse them and they'll just keep going along the road. need to drop to side lights to prompt a turn.

[polygonum_on_google]

The oil would be warm (still) for the return journey. But quite often the engine was already warm before going on this specific route. (Typically, I'd guess very similar temperature - not that I've measured it!)

We tend to use one car one day, the other car the next. Frequently we will have used the car a bit earlier. Will vary, but usually I'd expect this not to be much of a factor.

[tim...]

In theory

With a range of 80 miles (so the afore mentioned program said)

Cabbies will have to schedule several breaks into the day to top up

tim

[The Natural Philosopher]

I think that is a fair assessment, although you forgot pigeons.

But none of those are life threatening, (except the lamb)and all of them are good to eat.

[bert]

In article , "Dave Plowman (News)" writes

NO. A self charging hybrid uses the ice engine to charge the battery along with any energy recovery. As the battery runs down it is recharged by the ICE which can then run at its optimum efficiency regardless of demand. It does not provide plug in charging. A Plug In hybrid on the other hand has the battery charged by periodically plugging it into a mains supply or by any energy recovery. When the battery goes flat propulsion is provided by the ICE.

[bert]

Typical electric only range for a plug in hybrid. They're basically a tax dodge for company cars.

[Dave Liquorice]

No pigeons arond here, well there are a few in town but I've never seen a road kill pigeon.

[Paul]

Depends on whether your taxi regulations allow any old car to be selected for service.

Around here, I doubt a taxi driver would bother with a BEV. They really seem to like "Toyota Prius" :-) Why exactly, who knows. Maybe it's just less engine idling that they like. Like sitting at a taxi stand and listening for calls.

Paul