OT:Ship abandoned off Alaska after electric cars on board catch fire

The article also says:

As Hurricane Milton approached Florida last fall, Florida State Fire Marshal Jimmy Patronis warned electric cars and other battery-powered kit " are ticking time bombs.”

"In the aftermath of Hurricane Helene, we have seen nearly 50 fires caused by lithium-ion batteries with 11 of those fires being caused by EVs."

So, in Florida, they had 3 to 4 times as many fires caused by Lithium batteries not in EVs than by EVs. That got me starting to count. At the moment we have in the house:

A couple of dozen rechargeable lithium batteries lying around Several phones. Half a dozen computers with lithium batteries. Several multipacks of CR2032 batteries, and the like. Digital watches Rechargeable torches Drills Vacuum cleaners ...

Maybe, the watch batteries aren't a huge risk, but there's a lot of power stored in the power tool battery packs, for example.

I would charitably assume that these are power banks (possibly associated with solar).

They are getting reasonably common over here, and there may be many early adopters in the USA, especially out in the countryside.

Cheers

Dave R

But do we hear frequent accounts of these items combusting, either spontaneously or during charging? I believe the coin cells use a quite different battery technology, much older than the problem kind. They are not rechargeable and produce around 3V when manufactured, compared to the 4.2 volts of the rechargeable cell.

Most watches, I think, will use silver oxide or other button cells. My watch uses a CR2025, but no others for which I have replaced the batteries used lithium.

Presumably the larger modern batteries of power tools and the like are at risk of problems, but they must exist in hundreds of millions and yet never make the headlines. Phones, Kindles etc. must exist in billions at least, but only Israeli pagers seem to have difficulties.

Apparently, two battery fires a week on board planes. That's pretty scary!

eBikes seem to be gathering a reputation for causing fires.

Question: Whilst an ebike would seem to be (at least partially) an "electric vehicle", when that Florida State Fire Marshal used the term "EV", was he including or excluding ebikes?

The issuse difference is one of the battery being able to dispose of the heat while charging of discharging. In an EV the battery needs to be cooled so the risk of the battery catching on fire.

If you have a good surface to volume ratio, small battery it can dispose of all the excess heat without breaking into a fire.

Well all power lithium polymer are capable of doing Bad Things. The model aircraft community were the early adopters and I have seen several packs go up in flames.

One photo documented story was of a guy who left his powerpack on the car seat in a california car park while he went to work

The car was completely destroyed. Not by a battery capable of powering a car, but by one capable of flying a small model plane.

Not by a pack on charge. Just a pack left in the sun That was back in the noughties.

The problem is that a number of fires appear to be spontaneous. There is no identifiable external cause.

And if you are relying on headlines in the MSM for your understanding of the world, I have a bridge to sell you

Of course modern build quality is better and packs come with protection circuits to avoid over charge or over discharge,m but even so,.

My little mobile phone had a swollen battery from being in a car at over

Not the experience I have had with model aircraft batteries

But there are batteries in the pipe, that will change this.

The solid electrolyte battery, the fire properties will be different on that. The last announcement, the cycle life wasn't high enough on the work done in one lab.

There are also single crystal electrodes under research, that have been charging and discharging for five years, without detectable wear and tear on the electrode. This is the equivalent of driving 5 million miles in the car.

What I can't find, is any predictions on flammability for the novel batteries.

The thermal characteristics of the new batteries are different. Internal heating may be conducted more easily to the outer jacket. The car cooling system, then has to deal with the heat at that level (heat pump).

It's not possible to find everything I need in Google. Bing is no better.

Paul

AI might help - here's the final para of a long answer:

While single-crystal electrode technology may offer some safety improvements through better structural integrity, these batteries should still be handled with the same safety precautions as any lithium-ion battery system.

The battery battle is between weight, charge speed, safety and capacity/

You can always optimise one at the expense of the others

Lazaro Cardenas is at about about Lat. 18 deg. N, Yantai is at about

" Surely you would keep South of the most Northerly of the two points?"

That's not how great circle routes work. For example, London to Los Angeles planes fly near the N Pole, which is obviously north of both start and end points.

That explanation's probably not very convincing, because we are so used to seeing map projections that map the globe's surface onto flat paper.

Hmm. Ok. I looked at it on Google Earth, and it still seemed a long way. But then, I'm not a navigator. Once, my sailing brother-in-law delivered a new sailing yacht, as opposed to a gin palace yacht, from Hong Kong to somewhere on the West coast of Mexico, and he also went via Alaska. but we reckoned that was for something a little bit illegal. Maybe he was innocent after all. Having delivered the boat, and any cargo, he then caught a train right across Mexico to the US border at Brownsville, then rode the Greyhound Bus to meet us in Kansas City, Missouri. From there, he hired a Rent-A-Wreck car, and drove to Detroit. He returned the 'Wreck' to KC, as well. Finally, he flew back home, to the Philippines. To say he was a travelling man would be an understatement. His family name was Morgan, appropriately.

Depending where he dropped the boat off, that's more or less a straight line through Brownsville to KC.

Am 08.06.2025 um 11:24 schrieb Davey:

Yes.

US Coast Guard and civilian vessels have rescued 22 sailors off the

There are reasons people keep to established shipping lanes. Could be currents, could be proximity to land. Could be proximity to other ships.

Pacific - esp-. N Pacific is a big lonely place.

I looked at google earth. Alaska is indeed near a great circle route from China to Mexico, or at least not far off.

Useful tool. Never seen that

Thanks. At least I had the idea correct.