One for the Electricians- 5A sockets


While browsing the range of sockets available on Ebay, I noticed you can still buy the 'old' 3 pin 5A style ones. They are made by reputable companies so, I assume, still legal to install etc.
I've a vague idea these were at one time intended purely for things like table or standard lamps, but that could be wrong. Of course the plugs, at least at one time, lacked a fuse, and I assume they still do due to their size.
Are the sockets supposed to be on the ring main or a different circuit, protected by a fuse/breaker rated below the normal 30A you find on a ring main? If not, Is there something I'm missing re the safety side?
(I'm not planning to install any of these, nor do we have any, I am just curious.)
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Well, are the sockets shuttered? Do the plugs have shrouded pins. I have some here which have neither. I'm using them for my speakers at the moment. Brian
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On 18/11/2018 07:59, Brian Gaff wrote:

As I recall, the old ones weren't. Don't know about the new made ones.
I'd thought of using them in the past for low voltage- specifically a couple of constant current charging lines to charge batteries for amateur radio kit but decided they were too bulky. In the end, I solved the problem another way.
Thinking back, I know someone who had a house built about 12 years ago and I'm sure I noticed they had some installed for lights. Knowing the person, it wouldn't have been accepted if not legal etc.
Next time we visit I will have to check and see if they know which circuit the lights are on.
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On 18/11/18 08:48, Brian Reay wrote:

All sockets used in a domestic setting should be shuttered - 99% sure that's in the IET regs.
You cannot put unfused plug/socket combos onto a standard 32A ring (or radial). But you could put them on the end of a fused spur.
2A (and sometimes 5A) are commonly used for where you want a lighting circuit to control a table or floor lamp, which needs to be pluggable for reasons of moving for cleaning etc.

We used a 5A socket in our caravan for a 12V outlet - worked well.

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On 18/11/2018 11:37, Tim Watts wrote:

I like them for wiring under and over cabinet lighting in kitchens - switched from the normal light switch location. It means you can complete and test the wiring before the cabinets are fitted, then later any lighting concealed behind pelmets etc can just be plugged into the relevant lighting circuit(2).
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On 18/11/2018 11:37, Tim Watts wrote:

I added some Powerpole connectors to our motorhome. They are a very nice little connector, popular with radio amateurs and, I believe, some of the model car people. The larger Powerpoles are used in things like golf carts etc but the smaller ones are far more compact.
You can find them on Ebay. They come as a single connector, you slid two together to give +/- 12V for example and can be panel mounted or fitted to a cable. Once assembled to make, say, a +/- connector pair, they are polarised so you can't connect the wrong way.
See YouTube for more details.
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All switches have a live feed, it's the neutral that is often not there. If the loop in is done at the switch then neutral may be found only if it is done with T+E.
Richard
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On 18/11/2018 15:23, Tricky Dicky wrote:

Sorry, you are correct, I had intended to type Live and Neutral- silly omission.
>If the loop in is done at the switch then neutral may be found only if >it is done with T+E.
If I'm reading you correctly, that is probably something like how other countries do it. I think we've a couple like that, in rooms with wall lights.
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It's done over here too although up till recently I had only seen loop in d one at the rosettes. Our 1975 bungalow has the loop in at the switches but done using single core cables, the neutral is simply a single core going fr om rosette to rosette. My daughters new build has the loop in done at the s witches but with T+E so a neutral is present.
The only thing I find about the system used at my daughters is the back bo xes seem packed with cabling particularly one where she has two switches on one plate and one of the switches is part of a two switching arrangement t he back box is absolutely rammed.
Richard
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On Sunday, 18 November 2018 17:49:01 UTC, Tricky Dicky wrote:

I've got a four-gang switch in the bedroom, 2 x two-way for the bedhead lights, 2 x ceiling lights, loop in and out, and two extra loops where the smoke alarm / 2nd lighting circuit wanders through.
The old cables were all stranded imperial and cut really short too, so very difficult to dress neatly into terminal strip as a replacement for the Scruits(tm) what had been holding the neutrals together since 1968.
Owain
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On 18/11/2018 17:48, Tricky Dicky wrote:

As I mentioned, we've a couple of rooms like that but this is the only house I've seen it in of any we've owned. Even then, those have wall lights.
As you say, the back boxes are a bit 'busy'.
I'm not minded to go cutting into walls to replace the cables to switches so, if we want 'smart' lights in rooms with 'UK' style switch wiring, it will be using 'smart' bulbs. I've found the Ikea Tradri bulbs work fine with Alexa - including dimming- no need to buy any Ikea control box. They aren't, as far as my research shows, Hive compatible, but Alexa is, so that can control everything. They (Ikea) just need to produce them in B22 and a mini 4/5W golf-ball version for our wall lights.
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On 18/11/2018 17:48, Tricky Dicky wrote:

No neutral in, but you should see the back of the 4-gang switches used for 2-way switching at either end of our living room!
SteveW
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On 18/11/2018 23:01, Steve Walker wrote:

With a bit of careful organisation, you can get quite a bit into a switch backbox. I got at least 5 cables into this:
http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/File:LightSwitchBackboxConnections.jpg
It has power in, feeds out to a couple of lighting sockets, another to a pendant light, a feed in from an adjacent thermostat, and output to a wall heater. All with a triple switch on the front (one currently spare).
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On 18/11/2018 15:44, Brian Reay wrote:

There are a number of common ways of doing lighting circuits[1]. Loop in is common with ceiling roses.
[1] http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/House_Wiring_for_Beginners#Lighting
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just for the replacement market I would think ......
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On 18/11/2018 08:11, James Stewart wrote:

I thought that but I've remembered seeing them in a newish build (about 12 years old). The house was built to order and knowing the person, he'd have used only qualified / good people.
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you see something like that in hotels for the cleaners hoovers ... never seen them in the thousands of new buildhouses I have given certificates of completion to ..... but you never know....
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On 18/11/2018 09:07, James Stewart wrote:

Quite commonly used for plug-in lighting, switched from a single wall switch (for table lamps, standard lamps, stand-alone uplighters ... even Christmas lights), on self-build TV programmes.
SteveW
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More likely where you want to be able to unplug a low current appliance for cleaning, etc. But if supplied by a ring, needs a fused spur feeding it.
More commonly for things like table lights from a lighting circuit. Using a 13 amp one there means the possibility of someone plugging in the wrong thing and damaging a dimmer, etc. Although 2 amp is more usual for this.
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On Sunday, 18 November 2018 07:49:59 UTC, Brian Reay wrote:

They must be on 5A or 6A circuits, NOT 30A. Usually used on lighting circuits nowadays. They're not fused in the plug. Expensive for what they are.
NT
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