Live changing ceramic tap inserts

[nib]

Has anyone tried replacing ceramic tap inserts without stopping the feed?

My sinks and basic small taps have in-line isolators that make the job easy. But the bath doesn't. There are gate valves at the back of the airing cupboard, but last time I tried to use them they seized up and I had to replace them as well, a much bigger job.

I was thinking of getting a pad of softish rubber, and as the last threads of the insert come away sliding the insert away and pressing the pad over the hole. Then with the other hand, putting down the old insert and picking up the new, then sliding it into place and taking up the first few turns.

Obviously some water will escape, but I fancy most of it will go into the bath. Both hot and cold are 2-metre head.

Probably best done after the morning draw of hot water so no danger of scalding.

Will I get away with it?

Cheers, nib

[GB]

Get a pipe freezing kit for a tenner.

[Theo]

I did it when the valve developed a habit of falling out when turning on the tap. Water started gushing out, so I quickly screwed the insert back in. Next time I had the new valve ready so I screwed the new one in place of the old.

It helps it was on an instant water heater so the pressure was limited, and all the water went straight into the basin - so (aside from the water bill) it could have gushed all day with no problems.

I think I'd try opening other taps to reduce the pressure at the tap in question. If you can get the pressure down so it's not going to gush much even when fully open then it might be easier.

(the water for running the tap full for an hour probably costs you a quid or two depending on flow rate, so it's not implausible to do this)

Not sure what you mean by 'sliding', mine are screw in:

Just turn off the water heating so the last user runs it cold.

Theo

[Chris Hogg]

Can't you just freeze the pipe?

[John Rumm]

So, reading between the lines - both gravity fed and not mains?

If so, then it is easy - reach into the cold tank in the loft and put a bung[1] in the outlet. That will stop flow to both cold and hot taps on the bath. Note that if there is a shower, they sometimes add an extra cold outlet on the tank placed a bit lower than the one feeding the hot cylinder - that way you can't run out of cold water and get scalded.

You should then get very little spillage.

[1] Have a look at this page, it is primarily about CH systems - but much of it applies to gravity fed hot water systems as well.

[John Rumm]

Should also have said - block the vent pipe - that should also stop the water in the pipe escaping.

[The Natural Philosopher]

No need bob. Simply cut off the whole house water supply and if you have a gravity fed supply hook up the ball valve. Then runs the taps you want to work on until they stop

[Brian Gaff]

Might not work on the hot pipe. Brian

[Alan Lee]

Yes, really easy to do. Ease off the tap insert you are changing, until it starts to leak out slightly, turn on all other taps in the house, take off old insert with one hand, fit new insert with other hand. Keep a large towel nearby for leaks. The biggest problem you'll have is getting the right size insert. There are many types.

[GB]

If the water is running, no pipe freezing kit will work on either hot or cold.

If the water's not running, there's usually no real difference between the hot and cold pipes.

Obviously, turning the water off at source is better. For a start, it saves going out and buying a freezing kit!

[alan_m]

You probably need to remove the insert to establish size and number of splines to get a reasonably priced replacement. My very limited experience with a replacement was the item from the tap manufacturer was almost the same price as a new tap whereas a generic replacement was

1/3rd the price.

[GB]

A tap reviver kit will work perfectly well on a temporary basis, whilst you source a new ceramic insert.

Or, in my case, the reviver kit works so well that I have never got round to sourcing the replacement ceramic insert.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Realistically 99% of all stop valves will be stuck or leaking anyway, so one always turns off the mains.

What happens thereafter is modified by the plumbing layout

With a mains pressure tank, simply turning on the hot water tap under repair will work (unless someone flushes a bog and lets air into the system). With a gravity tank tying up the ball valve is indicated, with similar caveats.

You need to maintain a vacuum in a mains pressure system - any hot tap opened will suck in air and spit out water. And that goes for high taps in the cold feed also.

Ultimately its not hard to remove sufficent water flow from the system to make repairs reasonably easy.

[nib]

I checked all the upper part dimensions after just getting the handle off and it looked in every way like a fairly common part, so I bought that (pair). It also looks like the right internal depth too on offering it up to the outside of the casting, so I'll give it 90% that my spare will fit.

Some urgency has gone meanwhile. The cold was oozing out through the spindle seal while open but that seems to have lessened, and the dripping (no idea which side) is not getting worse - yet.

Thanks for all advice so far.

nib

[Fredxx]

A vacuum is very dangerous when applied to a tank, and I can never recommend it after seeing a tank collapse because the expansion and feed pipe had frozen in cold weather.

Agreed, or place service valves in strategic places.

[Vir Campestris]

I just gave up and had a man in to fix our shower flow. The stop valves did indeed leak (gate valves) but by leaving other taps on there was no flow to the shower.

There was also no hot water left by the time he'd finished to test it. The test failed, and he had to come back another day to fix it. At his expense this time...

I'll never ever EVER again get a shower with valves concealed in the wall. They look nice, they're easy to clean, and a ******** to fix. The first plumber made a sensible decision - he wouldn't touch it.

Andy

[GB]

I *ALWAYS* insist on bar mixers. I get sneery looks from salespeople who think what a yokel I must be. However, an entire new mixer costs £100, and they take 5 minutes to fit.

Similarly with bath mixers. Get one with fixed legs like this:

[GB]

I *ALWAYS* insist on bar mixers. I get sneery looks from salespeople who think what a yokel I must be. However, an entire new mixer costs £100, and they take 5 minutes to fit.

Similarly with bath mixers. Get one with fixed legs like this:

[alan_m]

But you still get people who box in the sides of the bath and then tile over giving no easy access to the underside of the taps without destroying much of their handiwork.

or the same person who tiled to the low level toilet system and then used a ton of grout to firmly fix the back of the system and lid to the wall. :)

[The Natural Philosopher]

Ive got 4 in wall mixers. All 20 years old. I suspect one has failed slightly as its thermostatic action is no longer effective. The rest are fine. I have full house softened water though. That makes a mighty difference.

Anyway, in three cases I can remove plasterboard from the wall on the far side for access to the units if needs be.

The bar mixers are essentially the same, except the pipes come trough the finished wall. In practice removing the cover plate of in-wall mixers gives identical access.