Getting a new energy tariff - or not

So how did it work before it was all done this way? It's not been like this for all that long has it?

... and anyway, why can't the suppliers do what the 'middlemen' do and cut out their profit margin?

Before that AFAIK there was only one supplier of volts which was your local electricity board. Which was nationalised and had no incentive to cut costs.

Well some, like EDF, do.

Time I switched again too. I've always used the Which? service because I (more or less) trust them and think they are a useful campaigning organisation, but does anyone have other thoughts?

The "direct debit guarantee" doesn't guarantee that they won't overcharge you and use the surplus to maintain their cash flow. I prefer quarterly in arrears, so I'm only paying for what I use. Of course, I don't actually pay by cash or cheque, I pay by bank transfer online. They don't give you the option of paying the quarterly charge by direct debit (after telling you how much). (Credit card companies and BT manage to do that.)

Monopoly middleman charging what ever they dictated.

Who does that? Did they offer that method or did you have to find out for yourself? EDF and British Gas don't seem to offer that.

Surely Which? recommends Octopus (according to the adverts) - much more expensive when I checked their tariffs this year.

nPower used to do that. That's how I set up my nPower account. But then they were taken over by e-on next and mysteriously it appears I have now "chosen" to be billed and pay monthly. I'm still paying for what I've used, in arrears, so it doesn't make that much difference.

Nick

Just like banks are simply middlemen between you and the money markets. You're free to cut out the middlemen and go directly to the markets, but you might find they can't be bothered with your puny transactions.

and was connected to a nationalised power station with coal delivered by nationalised trains from nationalised coal mines. No middlemen there.

Some own their own generation plant (like EDF's nukes), and some don't. It generally doesn't work to own many smaller generators, like all that rooftop solar.

Theo

So do the water companies. The energy suppliers seem to be unique amongst utility suppliers in almost demanding payment this way, and heavily overcharging those who don't/won't use it (and ripping off those who do - a win-win for them).

I pay all my bills by BACS immediately upon receipt. It's just taken me a couple of minutes to set up a BACS Standing Order for my Council Tax bill for 2021-22. The first payment is slightly higher than the remaining nine. The council gets paid a few days early; I know exactly when and what gets paid. I don't even have to check if a DD payment has been made - it's between my bank and the council to sort out any problem (although I've never known one to occur).

From what i understand, the energy companies' "DD guarantee" far from saying that they won't overcharge you almost guarantees they will! If not, why have Ofgem made a very-obvious public statement about the overcharging?

The system at EDF seems to have become confused and messy since they all started working from home. There seems no way for their agents to be able to immediately put you on hold then go and find things out. I'm on a Blue fixed until June and I expect to get an offer sometime in May. Of course from what I can tell, most of the other companies want you to use a smart meter, and I would if any of them could give me written agreement to make sure their customer unit was a talking one which are there. Nobody wants to do that. Brian

Stick to your principles and pay by check/cash/BACs and have a very restricted choice of tariffs and pay 10% to 30% more.

Often the initial DD charges are based on the figures the _customer_ gives to the energy supplier.

and they didn't need to make a profit for shareholders or pay vast directors' salaries

Most companies do not contact you to offer a new deal or even to say that your old deal is coming to an end. They make more money by just placing you on their standard variable tariff and hope you don't notice.

It's much like the insurance industry which tries to sign you up for auto renewals in the hope that you will be to lazy to notice that the introductory 20% to 30% discount is no longer valid, or that the excess amounts have risen.

The customer service from a lot of companies, not just energy companies, has gone downhill since the lockdowns, probably because of fewer staff or not having the full infrastructure for home working.

Another fiddle. Assuming there is a fixed cost to supply an individual bill rather than extract a DD payment, the charge should be the same whether the energy bill is £5 or £500. But it isn't - they apply a percentage to the bill. BT applies a fixed amount, the water company makes no charge. Why are the energy companies different?

For a new supplier maybe, but the energy company must know a longer-term customer's average usage. If the DD is consistently too high, resulting in the account being in credit every year, something is wrong.

And, OP, there is an option called "pay on receipt of bill" - if you insist on not using Direct Debit. Seems to cost about £200 extra per annum if you do so. Your choice.

PA

They do make a charge but don't show it as a separate amount. Being a monopoly supplier in an area means that they can also charge as much as they like for providing the bill. Billing and payment doesn't come for free.

Tim Streater brought next idea :

They are the retailers, between us and the wholesalers. They seek out the best deal they can from the wholesalers, it is then up to us to get the best deal we can from those retailers. I have no complaints, it works very well indeed for me. My costs have never been so cheap, relatively.

Exactly right - work with them, to minimise their costs and due to the mass of energy supply competition, it brings the overall cost down for you as a customer.

Where do you think they got their money from to make improvements for infrastructure etc? The magic money tree?

If nationalisation was such a good idea why weren't prices and service very much better BEFORE these services were privatised.