FCU in bathroom

[Uncle Peter]

My second guess was right. My first guess was some kind of large 4wd vehicle.

[Uncle Peter]

Incorrectly, yes. A dehumidifier ABSORBS water, not blasts it outside.

[js.b1]

Better to fit a fan, preferably internally thermal shuttered re draughts & mitigating some of the recent wind generated noise.

Zones for wet room style showers with level access:

- Where a shower is open, with no basin, there is NO Zone 2.

- Instead Zone 1 extends 1.2m from the shower OUTLET(*) in an arc & said ar c folds around obstacles in a secondary arc.

- A socket MAY be placed within 3m of the END of the Zone 1's arc.

At first glance that sounds like no room can have a socket, wrong: #1 - A bathroom of 16-20m2 is usually big enough to have sockets on the dia gonally opposing wall corner. #2 - Many appliances may be suitably fitted by SFCU, rather than a socket. As is typically done in higher end hotels hard wiring everything (in some c ases I note they use a cord outlet and SFCU, in case regs go more European) .

Technically you can argue no socket within 300mm of a wall corner, but in t hat case it comes down to frequency of unplugging - you can always remote s witch the socket should that be the actual issue.

Technically some argue any wiring accessory may be subject to condensation, where the surface temperature of the material falls below the dew point. T his is avoided by a) sufficient ventilation and b) not fitting such accesso ries to uninsulated exterior walls (colleague did this after a BCO brought it up, along with using an AI with his own electrician to avoid the BCOs).

Note, adding doors to even a level access wet room area in a bathroom chang es the zones. However, designing for no doors being present may be good pra ctice. Alternatively as a colleague did, proximity sensors on doors open op erates a shut off valve on the shower. Adds another layer of protection (an d ummm, failure risk).

The big problem remains portable appliances - there is NO regulation requir ing cables be reduced in length to respect zones. However since portable ap pliances cause the VAST MAJORITY of deaths in the UK (something our dimwit MPs and their lobbyists can't admit) it would be wise to hard wire as much as necessary. Colleagues water interlock on the doors is a neat idea, quali ty solenoid valves and proximity sensors are not cheap though.

A very large number of houses in the UK lack proper ventilation - re kitche n & bathroom. Short run & thermally shuttered fans do make a difference.

[John Rumm]

Notify, as in submit (and pay for) a building notice, yes.

...or employ someone who is a member of a scheme that allows them to self certify the work.

[js.b1]

The SI says "special location" means- "(a) WITHIN a room containing a bath or shower, the SPACE surrounding a bath tap or shower head, where the SPACE extends-" and goes on to define the vertical Zone & horizontal Zone (without using that term).

Interesting wording when you consider partitions & doors, definition of a room, very large rooms etc.

Quite why they could not just write "within Zones & their limitations as defined by BS7671" is just typical.

[Uncle Peter]

Like anyone bothers with that, that's absurd.

[ARW]

It would depend where you wanted to stick the shaver point" If it is outside the zones then you would not need to notify.

[Tim Lamb]

In message , ARW writes

Umm.. What about a towel rail mounted in zone 2 but fed by surface clipped flex from outside the zones?

>

[Huge]

Or you could do what everyone with a brain does; ignore the rules. So long as you don't do nonsense like putting sockets in shower cubicles, who is going to know or care?

[Tim Lamb]

Prospective lodger so I'm trying to follow the rules:-)

[F]

And we used them until they stripped them down to the bare bones. We use Premier Travel Inn now.

[ARW]

I assume that you mean ignore the notification process but still follow the

17th edition regs.

I am all for DIYers ignoring the notification part as long as they do a safe job.

[ARW]

A tricky one. The electrician could install the power point and leave the customer to fit the towel rad. The customer could then install the rad in zone 1.

If the rad is suitable for use in zone 2 then go for it. Points noted about the lodger status.

[Huge]

Ah, OK, in which case I retract my suggestion.

[Huge]

Not necessarily.

I'm all for doing a safe job.

[ARW]

The 16th edition was also safe -it just had less RCD circuits in the bathroom.

In fact it was probably safer than the 17th edition due to the bonding needed.

So am I most of the time:-)

[John Rumm]

The appliance itself would still need to be (S)ELV and IPx4 though...

[ARW]

No need for the SELV, it just needs to be suitable for zone 2. IPx4 should be OK for that.

[jrwalliker]

the Brits. IF you've got an ELCB, you can't hurt yourself even if it was I N the bath!

I wouldn't like to try that. An ELCB (RCD) does nothing to reduce the magn itude of the current that flows through your body. It just stops it after a short time which is still long enough for the experience to be very unple asant and quite possibly dangerous.

John

[Tim Lamb]

er.. Your pocket guide requires it to be *fixed, permanently connected and suitable for zone 1 according to the manufacturers instructions*. Doesn't mention SELV or is that implicit?

>