Earth connections giving wierd results

Nov 30, 2013 12 Replies

I had wall mounted spotlights in the lounge that were in wooden (double insulated) holders. I recently changed them for some modern ones in steel holders. I then found that the old supplies were without an earth and used two single cables with rubber insulation. This was probably from the date of construction of the house in 1958,

First idea was to rewire the whole place. I have done this in both of the houses I owned previously. However, having looked at the part P situation for DIY, and the fact that Stockport Council want about £600 before you can do anything legally, I gave that up as a non-starter.

So, I dug into the plaster and found that there was an earth wire (cut off and tucked up out of sight. With some effort, replastering, papering and repainting, I reinstated the earth. In this case it was a single uninsulated copper wire.

Finishing off the job, I did some continuity checks, as I have an aversion to blue flashes, bangs and smoke. I was puzzled by the results I got. This prompted me to do do some more checks.

The earth points on all of the sockets have a lowish resistance path back to the Earth bar on the supply. All of the equipment is working OK. There is no MCB or RCBO on the system, only the old fashioned Wylex fuse boxes.

Sorry for the long winded preamble, but the question is: -

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When I test some of the 13 amp sockets around the house, I discovered that measuring Ohms between Earth pin and Neutral pin as per the drawing gives me a result that seems to defy physics.

Resistance with switch in off position - open circuit. Resistance with switch in on position - short circuit.

The sockets are all single pole switched units, where only the live is switched. The Neutral is connected at all times. There are no fuses or MCBs.

How can this be?????

On other circuits the reading is low, about 2 ohms regardless of the switch position.

I am puzzled. Anyone know what might be going on here?

Al.

I had wall mounted spotlights in the lounge that were in wooden (double insulated) holders. I recently changed them for some modern ones in steel holders. I then found that the old supplies were without an earth and used two single cables with rubber insulation. This was probably from the date of construction of the house in 1958,



First idea was to rewire the whole place. I have done this in both of the houses I owned previously. However, having looked at the part P situation for DIY, and the fact that Stockport Council want about £600 before you can do anything legally, I gave that up as a non-starter.



So, I dug into the plaster and found that there was an earth wire (cut off and tucked up out of sight. With some effort, replastering, papering and repainting, I reinstated the earth. In this case it was a single uninsulated copper wire.



Finishing off the job, I did some continuity checks, as I have an aversion to blue flashes, bangs and smoke. I was puzzled by the results I got. This prompted me to do do some more checks.



The earth points on all of the sockets have a lowish resistance path back to the Earth bar on the supply. All of the equipment is working OK. There is no MCB or RCBO on the system, only the old fashioned Wylex fuse boxes.



Sorry for the long winded preamble, but the question is: -



formatting link



When I test some of the 13 amp sockets around the house, I discovered that measuring Ohms between Earth pin and Neutral pin as per the drawing gives me a result that seems to defy physics.



Resistance with switch in off position - open circuit. Resistance with switch in on position - short circuit.



The sockets are all single pole switched units, where only the live is switched. The Neutral is connected at all times. There are no fuses or MCBs.



How can this be?????



On other circuits the reading is low, about 2 ohms regardless of the switch position.



I am puzzled. Anyone know what might be going on here?



Al.


Few people take any notice of P

Its what I'd expect if the sockets were 2 pole switched. I'd test the sockets (fusebox off, open plug in the socket) to see if they were behaving correctly, then check the cabling connections at fusebox & so cket end, and if necessary see how they're connected inside the fusebox.

You could soon find out

NT

I would be one of them, were it not for the fact that I may be selling the house shortly.

Me too. That I why I mentioned that they switch the live only.

It is, that is how I came to find this situation.

then check the cabling connections at fusebox

I cannot envisage what might cause this at the fusebox. I will check it, but it is not so easy to get at.

cheers Al.

I would be one of them, were it not for the fact that I may be selling the house shortly.

Me too. That I why I mentioned that they switch the live only.

It is, that is how I came to find this situation.

then check the cabling connections at fusebox

I cannot envisage what might cause this at the fusebox. I will check it, but it is not so easy to get at.

cheers Al.

Well - you are right! With the benefit of the reading glasses and a torch I have confirmed that I was originally in error. They are double pole switches. (My face is red)

Al.

Well - you were right. I was in error. They are double pole switched units. At least I have learned that I need to use my reading specs more!

Sorry for the extra posts - I am using Mozzila Thunderbird and it is playing up. I post something and it says !"messaqge timed out" I post again and it appears twice!

It also hangs with the message "not responding" rather too often. Anyone got better free clients to recommend?

Al.

Sounds like you need a better newsserver, not so much a better client.

It would suggest they are not actually single pole...

It sounds more like a problem with your news server... (would hardly be news with virgin ;-)

Did you disconnect absolutely everything from the supply before you tested this. Some appliances might be muddying the water so to speak. Brian

Thanks Brian, I was sure the sockets had single pole switches. This proved not to be the case when I extracted the unit from the grout. They were in position when the tiling was done, hence were a right royal PITA to open up to check. When I did they were of course double pole switches.

Al.

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