Double glazing beading on the outside?!?

[Commander Kinsey]

Why do some glaziers fit the beading on the outside of windows? Surely, common sense tells us to put the part you can easily remove on the inside, for security.

[Brian Gaff (Sofa 2)]

Surely most of the outside beading is only cosmetic, the real fixings are inside, unless of course you have old ones like mine... grin. Brian

[alan_m]

Yes, there should be no removable beading on the outside. The frames are fitted without glass with the non-removable (plastic welded) beading for the glass on the outside. The glass panels are then fitted from the inside and the removable beading clipped inside to fix the glass in position.

[Andy Bennet]

Windows and doors may be glazed internally or externally.

Internal glazing means that the glass units are installed with glazing beads inserted into the frames from the inside.

External glazing means that the glass units are installed with glazing beads inserted into the frames from the outside.

Both are equally secure, provided either security tape or glass locks are installed, with external beading.

[Commander Kinsey]

[Commander Kinsey]

Agreed, although I wouldn't call the outside "beading". It's just a solid frame.

So why were some made with the removable beading on the outside?

[Commander Kinsey]

How can external beading be secure? The burglar just does the reverse of what the installer did. I've done it to my own and my neighbour's windows very easily. Them because they locked themselves out, mine so I could get a sofa into the house which wouldn't fit through the stupidly narrow hall.

What is "security tape" - the word tape makes me think it's easily removed.

What are "glass locks"? Surely just put the beading on the inside, then you don't need whatever those are.

[Andy Bennet]

Externally glazed widows tend to have thinner frames and look more aesthetically pleasing rather than the thick framed internally beaded units.

Internally beaded widows can be easily kicked in. Modern externally glazed windows have security tape (double sided tape with a rubber filler)_ on the iside of the glass securing it to the frame. This makes is virtually impossible to remove the glass from the outside even after removing the beads. You need inside access to prise away the glass from the tape.

Granted older type glazing from the 70's and 80's was externally beaded but did not have security measures fitted.

Any house is a piece of piss to break in to if you put your mind to it, it's just a question of difficulty.

[harry]

They aren't secure. However in the UK at least you won't find it any more. It went through a phase of having "security clips" fitted beneath the beads to stop the glass being easily removed.

[Commander Kinsey]

I don't see why, they're just fitted the other way round.

The amount of force to remove the beading on glazing I've seen would be more than that to break the glass.

Mine is as such, but was fitted in 2010.

Yip, I cracked the glass when I broke into my neighbour's house. External beading but difficult to get out (old and perished plastic - I think fitted about 2000). Didn't stop me gaining access, but I did damage their glass. I was trying to get in to let them in after they locked themselves out.

[Steve Walker]

Properly installed, older type glazing, without security tape, was not that insecure. When the external beading was clipped in, the glass was still loose. The glass was clamped into place (also jamming the external beading tight against the frame) by tapping (quite hard) a rubber seal between the glass and the inner frame.

It seems a common way at the moment is melting part of the frame to remove the glazing.

SteveW

[Commander Kinsey]

Pretty stupid to have ever invented it in the first place. A window, easy access point for burglar. Let's see, where shall we put the thing that you can peel off? About as stupid as fitting a Yale lock on the outside of the door!

[Commander Kinsey]

Mine was installed in 2005, I removed (and successfully and neatly replaced) the external beading, entirely from the outside, to remove the glass to get a sofa into the house. 5 minutes and a small screwdriver was all that was required. I made no noise at all.

Good idea. I was thinking a multitool, but that's loud.

What really amuses me is PVC doors with 7 point locks. But you can just put your foot through the PVC panel....

[T i m]

<snip>

Or after slicing though the tape with a craft knife etc.

Cheers, T i m

[Commander Kinsey]

Isn't that the other side of the glass?

[Fredxx]

Most glaziers use silicone sealant to stick the glass to the frame. It doesn't matter which side the beading is, no manner of levering will get the glass out in one piece.

[T i m]

On the inside, yes.

External glazing has an internal (rigid) glazing bead / frame and so

*would* be insecure if you *only* held the glass in with an external (clipped in) glazing bead.

So, they fit the frame, tape the inside of the frame but don't peel the outer protective layer off (/ completely), set the glass on spacers to get it central [1], hold the glass away slightly, peel the tape and then set the glass fully home, then tap in the (external) glazing beads (or various versions of the above).

The tape is usually black and very strong (like RC servo tape).

Cheers, T i m

[1] Or tow / heel if it's a side hung opener etc.

[T i m]

<snip>

Yes, if you break it.

You can't, you can only cut though it from the inside, try to prise the glass out then you will brake the glass in any case.

It would be if it was like that but it isn't. It's more like number plates that are held to your car via double sided tape but where the plates self destruct when you try to peel them off. Or external security / anti-tamper tags or ...

Cheers, T i m

[Commander Kinsey]

I'm glad mine didn't do that. So what do you do when you want to change the glass, or remove it for some reason, like I did to get a large piece of furniture into the house?

[Commander Kinsey]

This "external glazing" is confusing me. Could you just stick to "externally beaded"? The glass ain't internal or external, it's in the middle.

And why these spacers? Can't they just make the glass the right size in the first place? Sounds like a kludge to me.

Now that I'm familiar with.