Acoustic insulating flooring

[Scott]

Maybe not strictly DIY as it will probably turn out to be a job for the professionals.

Situation is that my downstairs neighbour has become a bit noisy - nowhere near the threshold for intervention by the council. My only concern is the bedroom (one room). I am wondering about a technical solution. I have only just started looking.

The building is 100 years old with lath and plaster ceilings, wooden floor boards and presumably something in between (ash?). My thoughts so far:

- To replace the ash with some form of modern sound deadening material

- To replace the floor boards with acoustically designed material

- To add something on top of the floorboards (I have some room to play with as there is hardboard in the hall but not the bedroom)

- To celebrate to the full the lifetime achievement of Black Sabbath as a tribute to musical excellence

There is a reasonable budget as I plan on staying and any improvements would be cheaper than a house move (and add value?). Could anyone out there point me in the right direction?

[Tim Lamb]

In message , Scott writes

You could have a look at Rockwool acoustic. No direct experience but plenty on the web.

Previous chat in here indicates you need to determine if the noise is airborne or travelling through the building fabric. Not my expertise but I guess TV sound would be airborne, tapping a pool cue on the floor.. fabric.

The best solution is to add mass (concrete) but I doubt you could do that in a shared building.

[Andy Burns]

option 5 - jump up and down in your bedroom wearing hobnail boots whenever there's too much noise ...

[Scott]

I'm convinced it's airborne. It's her radio. I could hear 'Sailing by'.

That is a point. I thought sand could be used but would require support as the ceiling would not support it.

[Tim Lamb]

Phase shift the same programme and re-broadcast to null:-)

[tabbypurr]

Start by blocking all the gaps. Stiffen the floor if you can with X noggings. Chip, OSB or ply over the boards will help.

Loose sand on the ceiling helps, but the amount you could put on it is limited, and it loves finding cracks. Better to put wet plaster on to make it thicker & stiffer, PVAing first to stick through the layer of dirt. Then rockwool.

Don't forget gaps round doors, and check for gaps under the floor where your flat stops - it may be wide open in some places.

Expanding foam can block tricky gaps, but be wary of its tendency to expand hugely with destructive force.

NT

[tabbypurr]

You can also get soundproofing mats for floors.

NT

[The Natural Philosopher]

Two things known to have worked.

1/. Acquire an ex-police band VHF radio of at least 100W. When music is too loud, first detune it badly, the add a noise generator or some other audio input, and use it. In general it breaks through into any audio. And will wreck any digital system while its on. Proved to work on social security scrounging drug dealers in social housing

2/. At 3 a.am. grab the left over airbombs from last years Guy Fawkes, and stagger downstairs into the garden bollock naked, point at neighbours house light blue touch paper and retire immediately. Highly amusing on soldiers just returned from action in the Gulf War. Recommended.

[Brian Gaff]

It also depends on the actual frequency of the noise. LF is harder to stop than hf. The lf is more likely to be structural. Brian

[Nightjar]

Simply replacing the floorboards with 22mm T&G cement filled particle board will go a long way to cutting down the noise. Make sure that the joints are all glued and put acoustic foam between the edges and the walls, to close off any air gaps there. However, while you have the floorboards up, you may as well fit acoustic mineral wool under the floor as well.

A heavy fitted carpet with thick underlay and, if necessary, acoustic mat under it, will help to reduce noise even further.

[Graeme]

In message , Scott writes

Assuming there is ash, or what looks like ash between floor and ceiling, you may be in Scotland? Anyway, our house in Aberdeenshire has that arrangement, and it was an excellent killer of sound until we had central heating installed. We were warned, before the work started. The answer is to plug every little hole that was created for pipe runs, and replace any other 'ash' that was removed. We didn't bother, as it is only the three of us in the house.

Sounds as though your building could be a house that was converted to flats? Any insulation between floor and ceiling would almost certainly have been disturbed during conversion.

[Scott]

Yes, Scotland. What is the problem with central heating? Does it dry out the ash or are you suggesting the installers may have removed it? If the former, my downstairs neighbour did have heating installed about two years ago.

No traditional tenement building.

[Graeme]

In message , Scott writes

When the property is built, the void between ceiling and floor is filled, but that is disturbed when any sub floor work is undertaken. I can only speak directly about this house, but floorboards upstairs were lifted and ash removed to allow pipe runs, both horizontal and vertical, and 'tails' for various radiators. The guy who installed told me that however careful he is, the noise insulation is never quite the same again. I would imagine rewiring or any other sub floor work would have the same result.

I suppose it depends how much upheaval you are prepared to endure, but, if you are contemplating emptying to room to lay new flooring, it may be worth lifting a floor board or three, to try and see just how much the ash has been disturbed over the years. I would stuff any gaps with ordinary fibre loft insulation, particularly around the edges and any pipe holes. We did that below the radiator, although more for draught proofing.

[ARW]

Would you have heard it called clinker?

[Tim Lamb]

In message , Scott writes

About as far away from you as you can get but poking around this site earlier there seemed to be several products for floor noise reduction.

[Scott]

Yes, I can remember that term from the fireplace in my childhood.

[Graeme]

Yes. I think that was the term the plumber used, although that was nearly 15 years ago.

[Andrew]

Years ago when doctors had a surgery in the ground floor rooms of older buildings, where the upper rooms were rented out, the standard way of soundproofing the floor+ceiling void was using crushed gypsum plaster on top of the lath and plaster.

Probably good enough to prvent confidential conversation leaking through but for a better result, why not take a look at building regs Part E and search for something called 'robust design' or similar. This is the standard way to make a house to flat conversion comply with Part E (noise abatement).

Be prepared to rip up all your floorboards and reposition skirting as a minimum effort, either that or overlay your entire floor with acoustic deadening material and construct another floating floor on top.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Think in Auld Reekie they use what are known as coffins. Wooden boxes fitted between the joists and filled with sand.

You can attenuate higher frequencies quite easily, but lower ones require mass. Think of hearing voices through a wall.

[Scott]

Thanks. I was coming to that conclusion :-(