True. And this happens to many people in this computer age. I was a high
energy physics machind operator. They obsoleted my machind and transferred
me to a new, much larger and more complicated machind when I was older and
less able to memorize large quantities of information. They didnlt lay me
off, but they instituted a, "geezer elimination program" (my descriotion)
where they paid you two weeks salery for every year you had been with them
(up to a maximum of a years pay.) Since I had been with them for 28 years, I
g9ot a years pay to leave, so I retired at the age of 61, but didn't start
collecting any social security until the following year, at 62.
There is an interesting story (and kind of nice one, too) about the above
program. We had an older guy nick-named, "Zack", who had been with us longer
than I had. He was a carpenter in the research yard, if I recall
correctly.One Friday, Zack told his boss that his wife was sick with cancer,
and it was getting harder and harder for him to care for her, so he was
going to have to leave. His boss comiserated with him and said, "OK Zack.
You don't have to work the normal two weeks. Just come in on Monday and pick
up your two weeks severance pay and go back home to take care of your wife."
Well, neither Zack nor his boss knew that they had just instituted their,
"geezer elimination program" that weekend, so when Zack showed up Monday
morning, they cut him a check for 26 times what he expected. Zack looked at
the check, and said, "There must be some mistake. You guys are paying me 26
times more money than you should." The accounting supervisor looked at the
check and said, "No mistake. You've been here over 26 years, so you get a
years pay for severance."
You speak as if it were a law. In Canada, it may well be a law. Here there
is no such law. If your employer wants to get rid of some people, he just
lets them go, but pays them for their accumulated vacion time. When I left
Stanford University, they didn;t even pay for ones accumulated sick leave. I
had around 6 months sick leave on the books, (I was almost never sick) and
didn;t get paid for that. Smaller businesses here in those days, didn;t pay
for vacations or holidays, either. Bsck in the mid 60's I worked for a place
that fixed shipboard radars, and one day, my boss said, "Tomorrow.s the 4th
of July, so you guys don;t have to come in". We all thought we would be
paid, but when we got our checks a couple of weeks later, we only got paid
for 4 days that week...:^)
Accumulated sick leave is a perk that is generally regulated by your
employment contract - if non-union it usually does not exist. Many
unions are having to let that "bonus" go. I say good riddance. Not
sure how it is in the USA, but since the sixties here in Ontario
vacation pay has been mandatory in all but a few select job classes
(education, police service, and a few others). It differs from
province to province. 4% of total earnings from day one, and 2 weeks
time off after one year - 6% and 3 weeks after 5 years in Ontario.
Statutary holidaysvary depending whether you are in a provincially or
federally regulated industry - some stats are provincial, some are
Again - this is Canada (and Ontario) specific. We are a "socialist"
society - The "american way" may differ.
On Sun, 07 Apr 2013 00:20:59 -0400, email@example.com wrote:
Most companies to have a policy where vacation is accrued during the
work year. Others though, do not and you get nothing if you leave
before July 1 or whenever shutdown for vacation is.
Why should anything be mandatory? Really, if you pay people enough
they can take care of the "benefits" as they see fit. Except that
most people don't have the willpower to save.
Some work schedules are other people dependent, such as an assembly
line or food service. Other people work independent of each other and
can be more flexible. I know a fellow that worked for a software
company. The rule was: you have to work 240 eight hour days a year.
This is what your pay will be every month.
My deal is even looser than that. I have no minimum time to work.
On Sun, 07 Apr 2013 19:35:57 -0400, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
Where did I say that? I didn't.
But needs and wants vary. Some people like to take long vacations,
others would rather have the money. No reason that the employee can't
have some say in what they do and prefer.
The fact that with a system of that sort, there is no overtime, no
lateness, no sick days, no absenteeism, no pay variances, almost no
limit on vacation time other than a 125 day maximum if you work it
right. It empowers the employee to take care of business as he sees
On Sun, 07 Apr 2013 22:56:10 -0400, email@example.com wrote:
Sure, if earned and part of the employment agreement. If the vacation
is based on time worked on a particular calendar date, you are SOL.
You are supposed to know the terms of employment when you sign on.
At many companies, you get a week after a year of employment. If you
can canned at six months, no vacation pay for time worked.
Employer can only steal if time was on the books. see above example.
The discussion has drifted to many areas or employment, few actually
having to do with the subject line.
In many, you get so many hours per hour worked. Some of those don't
pay accrued vacation time if you're canned, either. That's what we
were discussing. Your statement was that nothing should be mandatory.
I'm with you about 90% of the way but the above case is *clearly* in
the other 10%.
You don't even bother to keep the discussion relevant to the article
you're replying to.
That's the beaty of the Canadian system. It is "accrued" vacation pay
- which is separate from vacation time. You get the pay after 1 week,
6 months, or a year - 4% of total earned wages.
You only get vacation time after 1 year unless you negotiate
differently with the employer when hired. The employer cannot deny
you the time off, but you can negotiate with the employer if you want
to work 52 weeks per year and just take the cash. LEGALLY you are
supposed to take the 2 weeks time off.
IN CANADA (at least in ONTARIO, unless you are one of the few exempt
employers, you pay the vacation pay. Part time workers get it on their
weekly cheque - $x dollars an hour times hours + 4% vac pay.
Now I work on contract - so I only get paid what I invoice. No holiday
pay, no benefits, no taxes witheld at source, and no unemployment
insurance . So basically I'm paid like a Yankee, I guess. But I also
get to set my hours (within limits). If the "boss" doesn't like my
hours he is free to contract with someone else - and I'm out of a job
with no recourse. I am "self employed" operating my own business
selling my services to other companies.
Sounds like socialism to me. "The poor employee is incapable of taking care
of himself and making the right decisions in his life, so we will have to
tell him what to do. How to live, when and what vacations to take, what
benefits he should receive.... After all, we can;t have any of the ants in
the colony just going off on their own, can we?
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