# Glass for a wood rdisplay

I am in the process of finishing up a display case for my son. The case will have glass on the front and sides and have a mirrored back. Because of the design the glass is installed from the outside of the case. The rabbets that receive the glass are to receive glass that is 3/32" thick and a 1/4" radius quarter round. Arriving at the glass store that I normally purchase from there is a new girl working behind the counter. She apparently has been there long enough to know the jargon but is clueless when it comes to the actual thickness of glass. When she asked what thickness of glass I wanted, I indicated 3/32". Her response was, we only sell 1/16" and 1/8" thin glass for cabinet use. I knew 1/8" was too thick and 1/16" breaks too easily. She pulls out two samples of the glass and I look at their thicknesses and I tell her I want the 3/32" piece. She says again that the samples are 1/16" and 1/8" thick. I put the edges of the two pieces side by side and told her that one was clearly not double the thickness of the other. Yes, the thinner one is much closer to 3/32". Grabbing four of her 1/16" thick samples and putting into a stack and three of her 1/8" samples and placing those in a stack beside the other stack they are of equal height. I looked at her and said, four 1/16" thick pieces of glass stacked should not be the same thickness of three 1/8" thick pieces of glass stacked together. She looked at me like I was crazy.
When I got home the glass measured out with the dial caliper at 3/32" thick.
I do believe that she realized that the 1/8" thick piece was not double the thickness of what she was calling 1/16". I suppose that she did not understand that 1/16" is half of 1/8" thick. Geez.
Was this just me being like a noob to wood working and being confused with why a 2 x 4 is not two inches thick? In the past the seasoned employees behind the counter at the glass company knew what I wanted when I said 3/32" thick.
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The practical math skills of many folks these days are none. It is like counting change. Not that many people can do it. Remember back when you got somebody to actually count out change for you?
It could very well be that this person did not know that a 3/32" even existed.
And she probably greatly resented you upsetting her tidy little math world persective too.
My wife used to teach remedial math to grade schoolers as a volunteer. She had a simple plan. She used money. Just dimes, pennies, quarters, etc. They would practice buying and selling candy bars. When they all got it right, they ate the candy bars and kept the money. Her students learned math quicker and better than anybody else!
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If you want to really challenge your MATH SKILLS, try reading the Grocery Shopping Ads that (in our area) arrive in your mailbox (or local paper) weekly!
I use them with the grandchildren tasking them to find the best price on their favorite foodstuffs (and junk foodstuffs) giving them a sheet to record the ad price (like Buy two, get one Free) and the net price per item or unit.
I even devised a curriculum tool (in hopes the local schools might pick up on it) called Grocery Shopping Equals Math.
I guess we could now add "Glass Shopping" too.
But, instead of embarrassing the clerk, why not try and share your insights with her?
We all need to help train the next generation and its clear the "leave it to the schools" approach isn't working.

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I thought that stacking piles of glass samples next to each other would have been adequate. If she was embarrased, it saw not me that did it.

Agreed. The store oner should have filled her in.
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Back in the day I was a pizza del. guy and we didn't have a cash register to tell us what change to make. We had to count it out the real way, in our heads!!!!!

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Leon,
Just another sample of 'our' tremendous educational system. 'Learn by rote', and just enough to pass that pesky 'No child left behind' test. Fractions?, Decimals? Metric? *CONVERSIONS* ????
I've had people 'round off' a number like '10.2' . . to '11'. There just doesn't seem to be any mental connections between 'Cause' and 'Effect'. Or Sex and Conception, for that matter.
I really shudder when 'they' proudly say, 'These children are our future'.
Regards & Good Luck, Ron Magen Backyard Boatshop
SNIP

the
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"'No child left behind' test."
Given the implied age and experience of the clerk, it would be difficult to blame NCLB for her failures.
Indeed, it is likely that NCLB is part of the reaction to similar situations widely noted throughout retail transactions in America.
Of course, the clerk was like used to serving customers intent on replacing panes in relatively "standard" applications and whom either quoted the nominal measurements or simply advised of the application (window pane, six by nine inches) and accepted what was offered.
I wonderhow many of their customers took out a micrometer before setting off to replace the pane Jimmy's ball busted?
Maybe the arrived with a shard in hand, but carefully executed thickness measurements to the ten thousandth??
wrote ...

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wrote:

My question is, who sells 1/16" glass anyway? That seems awful darn thin.
I thought "standard" was 1/10" -- maybe there was a [sloppily] handwritten tag over the tenth-inch glass, on which the zero looked like a six...
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
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Doug Miller wrote:
<snip>

it's a common thickness for colored glass. it comes in 1/16, 1/8, 1/4, and 3/4. that thickness of clear glass also often used in small box lids or very small fish tanks, for example.
regards, charlie http://glassartists.org/chaniarts
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I am not sure that saying yourng was implying the age but she looked 28 ish. Young to me at 52 but then I was the manager of a tire store when I was 21. At 28 I was the service sales manager of a large GM dealership in Houston.

In this case, she asked me what thickness.

In my case I use the dial indicator to confirm my suspitions. Visually, it was obvious the the thinner piece was 3/4 the thickness of the thicker piece.
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Ron Magen wrote:

Nah, it's the job requrements and nothing much else. Anything beyond dollars and cents, as in 1/32" etc. is often beyond their comprehension simply because they have never had to use it and thus are unconcerned with it. And, I'm sure any OJT from a customer would be severely frowned upon. Give 'er a break, I say and if you must impart knowledge to her, do so clearly, concisely and quickly; she has other customers and things she may be expected to do.

That round-off makes sense in a lot of places. If you ask for 12.2' of something, most people aren't about to convert a decimal to a fractional inch, PLUS, it's normal for may places to round up regardless of the size wanted. In this area I don't think I have EVER bought an exact 8' 2 x 4; they're always about 8' 1/4" give or take (I assume for end-sanding?) but never less than 8'. It's the way they set up the saws. And I've gottten 10' a time or two because they were out of 8'. It's no big deal; off the shelf isn't expected to be useful.

That sentence and my sig are why I -really- responded to this! ;-)
Pop`
--
Children are the future;
unless we stop them now.
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During the 30 minutes that I was there, there was only one other customer. She is the first person a customer sees. She does need to know actual thickness of the product that they sell. None of the glass had sizes on the pieces, only a part tag sticker indicating style and or thickness perhaps.
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10.0 10.1 10.2 10.3 10.4
10.5 10.6 10.7 10.8 10.9 11.0
Do you see anything odd here? The first series round down to 10 and occurs 5 times in the sequence from 10 to 11. The second series round up to 11 and occurs 6 times in the sequence from 10 to 11.
When the rounding up procedure happens 10% more often than the rounding down procedure, what do you think the result will be if you have a Cray XP transact 1 trillion times an interest calculation. We're talking billions of dollars. Which is why they don't use that rounding procedure. They round even numbers down, and odd numbers up (or the other way around, I forgot), That way the occurance is balanced over large numbers of transactions.
IOW 10.2 could be 11?
r
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I certainly do -- you should have stopped at 10.9 .

But if you had started with 9.9, then you'd have 6 round-ups and 6 round-downs in a series of twelve.
What? You say that's not valid?
It's every bit as valid as including 11.0 in a series that properly should run from 10.0 to 10.9 .
Examined another way -- if you're going to include 11.0 in a series that starts with 10.0, then the next set should run from 11.1 (not 11.0) through 11.9, and you see 4 round-downs and 5 round-ups.

It doesn't.
As an elementary demonstration of your fallacy, consider this series -- and note that I'm even giving you the erroneous inclusion of 11 at the end:
10.00 10.01 .. 10.49 (all rounded down to this point) 10.50 (all rounded up hereafter) .. 10.99 11.00
101 numbers. 50 round down, 51 round up.
Extend it one more decimal point, and the numbers become 1001, 500, 501 respectively. And so on.

Oh, please. Who uses a Cray XP for financial applications?

No effect -- because it rounds down fifty percent of the time, and up fifty percent of the time.

Got a cite for that?
I didn't think so.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
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On Dec 15, 11:12 am, snipped-for-privacy@milmac.com (Doug Miller) wrote:

If I'm rounding a number to become 11, then 11 is in the argument. I am not rounding anything to become 10.9. If I'm rounding down a number to become 10, it is also in the argument.
Do NOT modify my argument to suit your limited ability to understand it.
My argument is valid as it stands. Adding decimals won't change anything.
Now go play with your straw men and red herrings elsewhere.
r
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I love the way this thread is going . . . but I'm glad I didn't mention 'significant number' !!
However, to clarify . . . the 'round off' incident occurred when I was getting gas to 're-fill' a rental car before returning it. I asked for 10 gallons. The pump stopped at 10.2. The 'jockey said . . . 'I'll round it off for you.' Naively, I figured 10.5 gal - a few tenths. Next thing I know it's 11 gallons. At 28 cents a gallon it's one thing . . . at \$2.40 it's a *significant number* !! {\$delta = \$1.92}. That's 'nearly' \$2.oo - and I'd rather it remained in MY pocket.
The point that initiated this digression to the original thread was that the clerk {and the 'pump jockey} had *no idea* of the concept involved. Further, regarding the glass, if you are going to represent a business and take a person's money for a product or service . . . it behooves you to know that product or service. Or at least have the smarts & 'intestinal fortitude' to say, 'I don't know, let me find out' - then go and ASK someone.
No, I'm not an 'old curmudgeon'. It's just that prices have reached a level that I *want* what I'm paying for - and don't feel *I* should have to compromise or accept incompetence.
Regards, Ron Magen Backyard Boatshop {Or maybe it's being married to a Medical Research Chemist-Study Coordinator, Physical Chemist/Thermodynamisist by training for 33+ years. I've GOT to be aware at ALL times !!}
(Doug Miller) wrote:

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But rental cars are supposed to be turned in full, not just so the gauge shows high. So, you were upset that the pump jockey screwed you when you were trying to screw the car rental company? (actually, the next renter that gets a short tank)
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MY ability to understand it is not at fault.

No, it's not.

OK, then, examine this series:
1.0 -> 1 1.1 -> 1 .. 1.4 -> 1 1.5 -> 2 .. 1.9 -> 2 2.0 -> 2 .. 99.9 -> 100 100.0 -> 100
51 round-ups, 50 round-downs.
There simply isn't the disparity you claim there is.
Nor does anyone use a Cray XP for financial processing.
Nor does any electronic digital computer round in the way you claim it does.

No red herrings and straw men on my part, just an invalid argument and incorrect understanding of how computers function on your part.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
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snipped-for-privacy@milmac.com (Doug Miller) wrote:

Excuse me. Should be 50 and 50.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
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On Dec 15, 8:48 pm, snipped-for-privacy@milmac.com (Doug Miller) wrote:

I don't want to. It is not MY series, and that series of mine is the basis of this discussion. Don't start dragging your stuff into my post. Go away!
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