Roofer's Contract Spec'ed #30 felt paper, but used #15 instead -- Suggestions?

[Don T. Spam]

My mother had her house re-foofed and as I was cleaning up the yard I found a felt paper wrapper for the 15 lbs kind. I had read the contract and it called for 30, so I was really concerned my Mom had been ripped off. I looked it up on the internet and confirmed it was definitely #15 (Esgard No.15 Asphalt Felt Plain).

After some more research, it seems it's not as serious of a cheat to use 15 instead of 30 on a low pitched roof like my Mom's, but I'm still pissed they'd take advantage of her like that.

My opinion of this particular roofer is already pretty low after finding a huge gash on the patio roof that they made and slapped a piece of icegard on it. They seem to think there's little chance of us going up on the roof to check it out....

I've already complained about the hole and they've agreed to come back and fix it properly. Should I even bother bringing up the felt paper? Other than these two discoveries, the roofing job looks okay. Does Northeast Ohio need 30 pound felt paper?

Is this kind of thing common?

[Robert Morien]

ask for a price adjustment or have them do it per the contract.

but never underestimate the impact that your lawyer can make

[Nehmo]

- Don T. Spam -

contract

- Nehmo -

• The wrapper paper alone isn?t conclusive. They might have had a roll of 15 on the truck.

• 15 lb isn?t going to make the roof fail, but if you agreed to 30 lb, that?s what you should have got. But mom already paid, didn?t she?

• You don?t have the knowledge to evaluate the job when you say it ?looks okay? otherwise.

• You?re going to trust these guys to correctly rectify when you already believe they?re ?pretty low??

• _Any_ wrappers left behind is sloppy.

• The lower the roof pitch, the more important the quality needs to be.

**You?re posting anonymously and you?re not naming roofing company; thus, you?re chicken, and because of that you?re unlikely to get any remedy. So quit trying to be mommy?s hero. She?ll love you anyway, and you'll look like a weakling when don't get the adjustment.

[m Ransley]

Get the city inspector out, I know it will mean pulling a late permit but it should only be 20$. Say the roofer forgot to do it. Then ask for an inspection . This is city inspectors job, is free-you actualy paid for it, and is why everyone can benefit from pulling a permit. If you found 2 things wrong he may find 20 more. Document everything in writing, as in emails. and record conversations, I do on contracts. Photograph issues before they fix them. Get a sample of paper from the roof to confirm it is 15lb, Email the manufacturer to see what they say about 15lbs adverse life spam vs 30. Then ask for a rebate of what you think is fair. If they refuse or are jerks, file small claim, its easy and cheap 35$ for me. Even suponea the inspector if you must go to court. I have done this. You should check his insurance and lisence, he is a hack and you never know what you will find. Your issue is common.

[Nehmo]

Shouldn't he also get a new constitutional amendment to cover the issue, m Ransley?

[Todd H.]

Nehmo's is either a troll, or the sort of person who'd do a job like the one the OP is trying to remedy.

People post anonymously because to name themselves and the roofing company would be making a faulty assumption that the roofing company might not hear about it, and thus undermine their cause. And, for the purpose of the discussion, does it matter who these individuals are?

And anyone who wouldn't try to be their parent's advocate when dealing with the service industry (which has a not-terribly-flattering record on giving a fair shake to older folks) is simply a shitty son or daughter.

Best Regards,

-- Todd H.

[Al Bundy]

Dishonest roofers will do this at times. They get to charge more and carry less weight. You can have an old beat up shingle roof and it still won't leak when the paper underneath is functional. The heavier paper is less apt to get damaged while installing the roof and will make the roof more serviceable. If you put an extra layer of shingles on later, which I never would suggest, it helps there too. I would not simply accept a refund of the tiny price difference on the paper. The installation is what you paid for. I would pursue it if at all possible for you to do so. I would spend money based on principle here. That's just me. My brother had his roof done by what was supposed to be a reputable construction company. However, the crew leader was dishonest. They thought they could take advantage of the situation as this brother lacked the knowledge and physical capability of inspecting the work. They ended up doing two complete tear offs before the work met the contract and I signed off on it. Fortunately, the owner of the company was reputable and did much work for the big insurance company. That provided leverage you probably don't have in your case.

[butch burton]

Roofing contractors seem to specalize in being rip off artists. The crook who did my mother's roof was paid to put on 30 year shingles - he used 20 and was forced to pay back a significant amount. Always always always watch these people with a hawk eye - yes there are honest contractors but there are armies of crooks out there. If they can save time of money by taking short cuts - they will do that.

When the housing boom slows down - hope the crooks get real skinny.

[ds549]

i had a guy do that to me and i told him i wouldnt pay because he broke the contract.i said only way id pay is if he put on what was in the contract.. he hassled me for a while then went away. lucas

[Nehmo]

- Nehmo -

-Todd H -

- Nehmo - I think I'm one, but what difference does it make? I could be a troll, a terrorist, or a tuba player. If you want to attack, you need to go to the merits.

-Todd H -

- Nehmo - Now, how does that follow? If one of my guys made a hole in a customer's roof, I certainly would make sure the customer understood that the event would require additional resources. But I'm a reasonable contractor. Something like that wouldn't cost the customer too much more.

-Todd H -

- Nehmo - Most of the time they post anonymously because they're cowards. I know; I've done it a few hundred times.

And isn't the defense of the anonymousness up to the one who is anonymous? I challenged him, and he chickened again.

-Todd H -

- Nehmo - Yes. It's not a hypothetical discussion. There is a real roofing company that others may use of may have used. OP is selfishly not alerting them and he is inhibiting potential first-hand advice.

Moreover, credibility counts. Anonymous cowards don't have much.

-Todd H -

- Nehmo - Lots of sons try to compensate for years of inconsiderateness to mom by posing as her saver from some third party. Often these kids are still getting money form mom.

[Todd H.]

I dunno there Nehmo... I think we have a new poster child for the Blame the Victims League of Unsubstantiated Claims and Prejudices.

Point is, you unfairly attacked a guy whose trying to do some research or brainstorming to keep his mother from being taken by a roofing contractor. If someone is strategizing how to rectify a given situation, that they post anonymously and don't name names actually keeps a card in their hand that they can play in the future: that is, the value of a disatisfied customer being able to say "I'd really like to avoid having to make a big deal about this situation not being resolved. I'm sure you have spent a lot of effort trying to build a good name/reputation for your company. And, well... let's just say that I have the ability to make a LOT of noise if this isn't resolved."

To hold that card rather than playing it at this point isn't cowardice, nor is it an indication of being dependent on Mom, it's simply reasonable and intelligent.

But, I do have to say, you've given us some interesting insight into your psyche, and perhaps past/present experiences with such an interesting view on the world.

Tell us about your childhood.

Best Regards,

-- Todd H.

[PipeDown]

The housing boom will never slow down unless we all stop making babies.

As for evaluating contractors, there is a growing website called

which has customer reviews of contractors. It is not in my city yet but I definately would use such a resource as well as checking the licence for complaints before hiring a contractor.

Checking up dosen't always help when you are going for a bargain price by hiring samller unproven contractors. in that case, you have to know what you are buying and how to tell if you actually got it.

[Trekking Tom]

Did he put 2 layers of 15 pound felt on? If he put 1 layer with a 4" overlap time to be mad.............

[Don T. Spam]

I think you're reading too much into my post. Assuming you don't consider yourself a coward, you may have issues with your mother for naming you "Nehmo".

Thanks, anyway.

[Ed]

"Nehmo" wrote

I think you're a roofer and one I hope never to hire.

[JTMcC]

What a bloody idiot.

JTMcC.

>

[Kickstart]

...

the roof may have been done with 2 layers of 15 , arguably equal or better than 1 layer of 30 All you have to do is ask. Also all felt may have been 30, the wrapper may not be directly from your home , Ask

They may have run out of 30 and finished 1 section with a piece of 15, you could ask. Some shingle mfgs insist on shingles being installed over 15 lb felt as stated on the wrapper instructions I'dbe more concerned that the shingles were nailed to code and flashing installed and cemented properly

kickstart

[Nehmo]

- Don T. Spam -

- Nehmo - Sorry, but anonymous cowards have no talking room when it comes to names.

[Nehmo]

- JTMcC -

- Nehmo - ?bloody?? Are you a Brit or something?

[Nehmo]

- Ed -

- Nehmo - I?m not contracting, nor do I currently plan to contract, any roofs. But even when I was doing roofs, because of your self-importance, you wouldn ?t have met my qualifications for a customer.

So sorry, but it doesn?t matter what you hope never to do.