stuck again!"
QED
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15 years ago
Range clock - Disconnect it!
Loading thread data ...
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15 years ago
formatting link
>>>
Pathetic.
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15 years ago
= about $1.50 a year
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15 years ago
On 6/4/2008 6:15 PM Rod Speed spake thus:
Exactly.
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15 years ago
Again with the introspection ...
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15 years ago
Pathetic.
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15 years ago
Pathetic.
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15 years ago
duh.
Remember, that figure is for a single, solitary, one watt load. You're correct tha on an individual basis, it's nothing. Of course, in reality, in an average home that value is actually on the order of twenty to one hundred times greater than one watt. Eventually piffling little expenses like this add up for people, some more than others.
On a national basis, in the context of national energy policy, it becomes truly significant.
.max
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15 years ago
Vinyl is back.
Seriously though, the "wet paper bag" response is about the best indicator you have that he's lost the argument and given up.
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15 years ago
If designed properly it would. A TOD clock chip needs power 24/7, but a countdown timer chip doesn't need power when the device shuts off.
Bill Ranck Blacksburg, Va.
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15 years ago
snipped-for-privacy@vt.edu wrote
Nope.
But that can be done with a coin cell that lasts for years and is with most watches and clocks.
Sure, but the difference is completely trivial in practice, you get the shelf life of the coin cell in both cases.
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15 years ago
max wrote: ...
The key word here is "relatively"... relative to what? We as yet don't have a single large-scale energy storage system that I'm aware of.
Also, I didn't say wind "requires" more fossil and it can replace a fraction of peak demand.
My point was (and still is) that one cannot build a 100(say) MWe wind farm and expect to get 100 MWe from it in the same sense one can build an equivalent 100 MWe of conventional (fossil or nuclear) generation. Hence, the idea many promote that simply building wind farms eliminates the need for conventional generation is imo even more intellectually dishonest.
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15 years ago
single large-scale energy storage
You need to get out more.
There are a number of those using hydro systems that get the storage by pumping water up at time of excess supply from the baseload coal generators and return that power to the system at times of excess demand by letting the water down again. Like the Australian Snowy system that is primarily a storage system for the entire SE Australian grid and generates only a minor part of its output from a single fall of water.
of peak demand.
need for conventional generation is imo
Correct.
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15 years ago
watches and clocks.
Of course nobody builds kitchen appliances that way.
Again, nobody uses coin cells in kitchen appliances, they all leach power from the mains to keep their TOD clocks going. Adding a battery would add manufacturing cost, just changing to a countdown timer would not.
Bill Ranck Blacksburg, Va.
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15 years ago
snipped-for-privacy@vt.edu wrote
watches and clocks.
But that does show what is trivially feasible current use wise.
Again, since you get the shelf life from the coin cell, that shows just how much mains power is actually wasted in that TOD clock, nothing.
And getting that trivial current from the mains doesnt.
Just leaving the TOD clock with that trivial current drain doesnt either.
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15 years ago
...
I am fully aware of pumped hydro storage. They're of da'ed little value for the locations of most wind farms on the High Plains where there are (a) no hills, (b) no surface water.
--
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15 years ago
dpb wrote
a single large-scale energy storage
If you were, you wouldnt have made that stupid claim you clearly did make.
Plains where there are (a) no hills,
Pity about the SE Australian grid where the wind farms are part of the SAME grid as the pumped hydro storage.
Your 'as yet don't have a single large-scale energy storage system that I'm aware of' is clearly just plain wrong.
AND it aint the only one either.
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15 years ago
...
No, I simply don't equate pumped storage w/ electricity storage -- they're separate forms...one _uses_ the (temporarily) excess power to refill the power supply, the other would be a storage of the electric power itself to be used later.
High Plains where there are (a) no hills,
Well, SE Australia isn't the US High Plains. There would have to be even more currently nonexistent transmission lines built to supply the power to somewhere there is sufficient elevation difference and water to complete the system and that ain't within anywhere close. CO has elevation but very little excess water. KS, OK, TX, NE, etc. have minimal elevations. Catch-22.
Again, I repeat--even if pumped storage were the pancea, that _STILL_ is an alternative system that would have to be built as a complement to the wind farm system which _STILL_ is an added cost burden.
Agreed, used to live just down the road from Smith Mtn. But, it still ain't the same thing...
--
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15 years ago
dpb wrote
have a single large-scale energy storage
Yep.
Then you are just plain wrong. That is precisely what they are.
Nope.
other would be a storage of the electric
They are BOTH storage of electrical power to be used later.
High Plains where there are (a) no hills,
You never said anything about the US High Plains in that stupid claim you made that "as yet don't have a single large-scale energy storage system that I'm aware of"
built to supply the power to somewhere there
ain't within anywhere close. CO has
elevations. Catch-22.
Irrelevant to that stupid claim you made that "as yet don't have a single large-scale energy storage system that I'm aware of"
No one ever said it was.
complement to the wind farm system
Not when its already in place to allow constant loads on coal fired power stations in massive countrywide grids.
Wrong, as always when its already in place to allow constant loads on coal fired power stations in massive countrywide grids.
the same thing...
Corse it is.
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15 years ago
have a single large-scale energy storage
other would be a storage of the electric
High Plains where there are (a) no hills,
built to supply the power to somewhere there
ain't within anywhere close. CO has
elevations. Catch-22.
complement to the wind farm system
Well, except it isn't...
Except it isn't...
the same thing...
Except it isn't...
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