Looking at hankook dynapro atm LT 265 75 r16 123r.
2004 nissan xterra What is the diff between 123, 114 and 112?I want the rugged look but if LT looks the same as a P ill take the P. I am not doing rocks but do snow. I drive paved roads in Pa but only about 5000 miles a year.
The LT are about 40 bucks more each.
Are you looking at these online or in a store?
If appearance means more, check pictures here
Looks like the P has raised white lettering, LT does not. Otherwise pretty much the same.
Thanks. Letters go in, black out. I need to look at previous poster....
Joan, online. Free shipping from prime.
Ok, thanks for the reply.
Ok. Sorry. My goal is to have tires that are P compared to LT. If they perform the same in city. and look the same ill go cheap.
I had that tire in the P designation on our '99 Toyota 4Runner , got about 30k on them and the handling was iffy . Wanted the LT in the same size this time but the dealer couldn't get them . I ended up with Kenda Klever A/T's in LT265/75R16 and we like them a lot more . The stiffer sidewall makes the handling much more predictable . They do hum a bit , but not objectionable .
Thomas wrote in :
You can't get better prices on name-brand tires than Simple Tire. Often with free shipping, which adds 5x15=$75 to Tire Rack prices shipped.
I looked up what the difference is between P and LT
It seems the naming different is mostly bullshit because the only construction difference that changes the specs is in the load rating, which is _already_ in the basic tire specification (so you didn't need them to tell you the load range twice).
One article said a load rating of X is 9% higher for an LT tire than a load rating of that same X for a P tire, but we would need to doublecheck that to be sure because it sounds inconsistent with federal specs.
Here's a direct quote from an article above: "For example, a euro-metric or P-metric tire designed to carry 2,000 pounds on a car is restricted to carrying 1,820 pounds when that same tire is used on a van, pickup truck or SUV."
I say the difference between P and LT is mostly bullshit and not totally bullshit because it seems the construction often has an extra belt under the tread in addition to sidewall stiffening plies.
Also, the LT tire may or may not have a rubber formulation that resists chipping on gravel roads - but you have no way of knowing that from the spec so it doesn't help you in the least whether it has it or not, when it comes to choosing tires.
Of course the _ride_ will almost certainly be different between a P (of 10% more load rating) and an LT (of the load rating) since the LT is constructed beefier, and you can often put in more air pressure to boot.
So while the P versus LT designation difference is mostly bullshit, the ride and construction is not.
But in the end, it's mostly the load range which is different in construction, which you already know from the load range spec.
After balancing and installation, is the mail order route that much of a savings for tires?
Specs do not tell the whole story. LT rated tires generally have a stiffer side-wall than a P rarted tire of the same load rating, and therefore are more stable under load.
The difference fron P to LT rated tires on my usually lightly loaded ranger was quite noticeable. The LT may ride a bit harsher unloaded, but the handling really tamed down.
Your asertion that the rating is "mostly bullshit" while the construction is not is "mostly bullshit". A P rated tire that, when de-rated for light truck use, excedes the load rating of a given LT tire is still not as stiff in the sidewalls as the typical LT tire.
The FACT there is a difference proves your assertion that the rating is "mostly bullshit" IS bullshit.
Up here in Ontario it CAN be.
My son-in-law ordered in tires for his Ram from Quebec and saved over $400.
He ordered in tires for my daughter's Honda Civic and saved about $100 over the same tires purchsed in province.
(both basically equivalent to getting one tire free)
Untill the exchange rate took a dive, much greater savings could be realized ordering out of the USA, depending in the shipping method.
That said - I buy locally because if there is a problem, dealing with a local supplier is MUCH simpler.
Good point ! When they sell you the tires, our local Costco charges $ 15 for install & balance plus taxes. Some shops charge more. If they're doing it for your mail-order tires - more yet .. John T.
I am in a major metropolitan area in the USA so, I am not sure the Canadian experience is relevant with regard to pricing.
Do you have any opinions about tire brands? Are there any which represent exceptional value in your opinion? I couldn't care less about buying American made, I want the best bang for the buck. The best tread life is my primary concern, so I usually stay far away from "H" rated tires.
None wrote in :
Impossible to answer that question accurately because it depends on the price of the tires at the local shop versus the online price.
If you go to just any shop for installation, the installation cost is the same (usually), but that can vary by installer. For example, Costco doesn't charge for installation, as I recall, but they won't install tires that they didn't sell you.
Almost ever other tire shop, if not every other tire shop, will install any tire you show up with, as long as it is "safe" (meaning it meets tread depth, sidewall damage, speed ratings, etc).
On the other hand, Tire Rack will ship the tires to you, or directly to the shop, and the price is whatever price Tire Rack has agreed with your local shop by contract.
Usually the Tire Rack negotiated price for installation (which includes balancing, stems, and disposal) is a few bucks cheaper than the walk-in price for installation - but you can just show them the Tire Rack price and most shops match it (saving about five bucks per tire or thereabouts).
In the end, I can't give you an accurate answer because of all the variables, but, you'd have to be pretty lazy to NOT save about one quarter to one half the cost overall by shopping online and having the tires shipped to you or directly to the shop (which they do all the time).
Plus, I keep getting sales coupons from Simple Tire who is hungry as hell for business, so they are about 2/3rds the price of Tire Rack, and at least half the price of most local shops.
But I must repeat it's impossible to answer the question accurately.
Clare Snyder wrote in :
I agree with you. I never bothered to look up LT versus P before. So all I know is what I read in those four articles. I never said I was an expert and it should be clear that I'm not.
However.... I did read what it said in those articles. And, I do note that the OP is not a tire expert.
I also note what the OP seems to care about, which was first and foremost, "looks", and then "price".
That's all the OP said he cared about.
He didn't even ask about the ride. He didn't ask about carrying a heavy load.
He did ask about the load range, which, the articles said, isn't the same between an LT and a P by about 9%.
So he's not a "tire engineer" and he's not a "racing expert".
He cares about "looks" and "price". For those concerns, the difference between LT and P is "bullshit". :)
The problem here is that everyone is guessing how the OP's ride will handle. Nothing wrong with that but the OP didn't ask about ride. The OP didn't ask (directly) about load handling.
The OP said he cared about "looks" and "cost" and the OP asked what's the difference between an LT and a P.
For "looks" and "cost", there is no (direct) difference since it's just a slightly different number system.
The problem is that word 'slightly'.
The only difference between an LT and a P according to those four articles is that the LT _usually_ has stiffer sidewalls and the LT _usually_ has an extra ply under the tread and the LT _sometimes_ has rubber that chips less and the LT _may_ run rougher.
All those things above are guesses because there's nothing that says it has to be the case but it's _usually_ the case.
The only non-bullshit difference between the LT and P that the OP can bank on is the load range.
Assuming for the moment that a load range of 100 means 1000 pounds, the only difference between an LT and P size that the OP can rely on to be a fact, according to those articles, is that the LT load range of 100 means
1000 pounds, but for whatever strange quirky reason, if the OP puts on a P, he needs a higher load range by 9%.That's the part that was definite in all the articles, but for some strange reason, it makes no sense to me to have a load range of 100 mean a different thing in an LT tire than in a P tire.
So maybe you can explain to me why the government did that.
Why does a load range of 100 mean 1000 pounds in an LT tire, but only about
900 pounds in a P tire? Makes no sense to me.
See above explanation pointing out that everything everyone is saying is a "guess" which is that the LT is "built sturdier" but it might not be since there's nothing inherent in the LT or P rating that means it has to be built sturdier.
It probably is built sturdier. I'm not saying that it's not. I'm saying there's nothing inherent in the P or LT that proves it's built sturdier.
You're guessing. Your guess is probably correct. I'm not saying it's not correct. I would guess the same as you do.
But there's nothing inherent in the LT or P rating that I can see which ensures that it's actually stiffer or stronger.
I hope you understand that I'm explaining something that is technical to someone who cares about two things and two things only.
Price. Looks.
For that purpose, the difference between LT and P is meaningless BS.
My advice to the OP given "cost" and "looks" are what he cares about? Simple.
OP: I suggest you find a tire that you like the looks of, and that has a load range that meets the OEM spec for your vehicle at the best price you can find.
If that tire is a LT, then you're done. If that tire is a P, then make sure the load range is 9% more than you need.
That's my advice, which is based on logic, which is based on reading those four articles and understanding the difference between an LT and P tire.
On 4/5/2018 7:55 AM, Erholt Rhein wrote: ...
1/1.10 --> ~0.91It depends which figure you're using for the reference; on is the derate percent while the other is the allowable above; same figure, no inconsistency.
The quote is restriction on OEM for sizing guidance on new vehicles depending on the target market for the specific vehicle; primarily passenger or cargo use with the caveat to add some additional safety margin to cover the propensity to overload such vehicles outfitted as primarily passenger use.
...
They're two spec's for two purposes; each says what it says and it takes difference in construction/materials to meet the difference, no BS at all.
Are there other spec's/quality areas as well? Of course...but that has no bearing on what P vis a vis LT means.
On 4/5/2018 12:43 PM, Erholt Rhein wrote: ...
...
At least one of the article _did_ explain that; it's to provide some additional consumer safety margin for the class of vehicles that tend to be more frequently overloaded or loaded to their max but that were provided P-class tires for the extra comfort by the OEM as the vehicles are produced and marketed primarily as passenger rather than cargo vehicles. The derate of actual tire load range spec is imply for an added safety margin.
That comes from NHTSA rulemaking--
As far as the actual difference between what it takes to build a P or LT rated tire; none of those articles are anything but consumer information at a nontechnical level; the details are in the actual spec's; I'm not sure who has those; possibly the Tire & Rim Association in US; they're the trade group of those manufacturers who work out the interchangeability standards, etc., ... Whether they or SAE or ASTM or NIST or just who has the actual tire industry standards I don't know but they're out there somewhere and it's those that tire manufacturers will meet or exceed for a given tire.
On thing to note: Standards do _NOT_ tell the manufacturer _how_ to design or build the tire; that's their perogative to do so in the best way they see how competitively and economically; "all" they have to do is to meet the spec through the qualification/testing process.
I recently bought 4 tires at Just Tires. Goodyears. Got $200 for signing up for a Goodyear credit card. So I broke even.
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