Ahh, but it appears that the point of my OP was missed.
The vehicle info was *purposely* left out because the question, as per the subject line, was about the *Decision Process*, not about at what mileage the timing belt should be replaced in any given vehicle.
Given that odds are the owner isn't going to keep the (any!) vehicle for the alleged life of 2 timing belts (220K) or even the "dealer life" (180K) why would he (or a mechanic) consider waiting any longer than the 90K suggested in the manual?
It was about the logic behind deciding to delay the replacement and not about the life expectancy of the belt in any specific vehicle.
But the decision process takes a different path depending on whether a failed belt causes damage or just leaves him stranded, which depends on the vehicle. I think leaving out the vehicle was based on underestimating the complexity of the question rather than wanting a complex decision tree as an answer.
So since you acknowledge you purposely left out key information how could you hope to get reasonable answers about the "decision process"? In what way would it have hurt to disclose the type of vehicle so the very pertinent info as to whether it was an interference engine or not?
I can almost guarantee the problem was not the quality of the replacement part but the intelligence of the trained gorilla that installed it. Chain tire stores are NOT the place to have mechanical repairs performed.
GENERALLY the tranny problems (in the last 15 years) can be almost eliminated if the fluid is changed often enough with the right fluid. Once every 15000 miles, or maximum 2 years, is about right.
It was at a Goodyear and they replace front end parts all the time. Much rather go there than to some independent mechanic...and no, I'm not gonna go to a dealership.
Or just the roads on which the car is driven. I had a front wheel bearing replaced on my last company car, it literally lasted three days before the replacement started making noise. The noise started immediately after hitting a monster pothole on an onramp; looked like an asphalt patch, wasn't.
Fortunately, it was replaced shortly afterwards - I didn't want to have to explain why I needed two new wheel bearings within a couple hundred miles of each other...
If it's anything like the Goodyear store near me, they replace front end parts all the time, whether they're needed or not.
My wife and son both bought tires at the local Goodyear within a few months of each other. They were both told that the ball joints were too worn to do a front-end alignment. They were both told that they needed the right *and* left ball joints replaced before the alignment could be done.
After being quoted prices in the $500 range, they both went for a second opinion - to different places.
My wife ended up needing one replaced, my son didn't need either one.
When they compared notes once they realized that the same thing had happened to both of them, they found that they both told the same thing, just about word for word. "On a scale of 1 to 5" was the technique that Goodyear used, and the numbers they were told matched, side for side. Coincidence? I think not.
I've seen more "disasters" come out of tire shops like Goodyear/Firestone etc over the years than I care to count. And a lot more un-needed front end repairs, improper replacement of bearings etc than you would ever believe. MOST independents do better work - in many cases the tire shop "mechanics" are not qualified - just like a lube shop.
DerbyDad03 wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@j8g2000yqd.googlegroups.com:
Are you sure about that 90K limit? I thought that by 2004 the OEM belt was good for 105K/84mo.
Having said that, Honda builds a pretty big safety margin into their OEM belts. I've seen the 90K ones go as much as 150K before breaking.
If you really want to push this, you're /probably/ OK until about 120/130K. After that, it's a crapshoot, as is valve damage ($$$) when the belt does finally slip/break.
So look at it this way:
Say you spend $600 to get the job done /right/, which means water pump, tensioner and coolant as well as the belt, all with proper OEM parts. And you do this at 90K. Now you hang on to the car until 150K. This means your $600 is amortized over 60K miles. That's one cent per mile.
Now, say you wait until 120K to get the job done, but still get rid of the car at 150K. $600 over 30K is: two cents per mile. And you're running the risk of belt slippage/breakage, and the resultant risk of valve damage. Plus the risk of being stranded at possibly a really inconvenient time.
I can tell you that you will almost certainly NOT make it to 150K on the original timing belt, so you /are/ going to need to spend at /least/ $600 at some point unless you dump the vehicle at something well under 120K.
So, ultimately, your question involves pennies and dimes.
The Beach Boys saved their pennies and they saved their dimes for that 409, but nickels and dimes aren't worth much these days.
I'd use them for an oil change, but nothing more technical than that. Many try to sell you stuff you don't need. Some are good, many are not.
As for independents, you have to find a really good one. Some are great, others are thieves using wrenches instead of a gun to stick you up. If you find a good one, stick with him.
Agree on the dealer. Rare I'd take a car to one aside from warranty work. Prices are usually the highest, but they usually have good mechanics if you need something that is particular to the brand you are driving. My dealer, though, does oil changes cheaper than anyone and they wash the car too. I'd never let them to the so called xxx miles service though.
Of all the cars I've owned, only one ever needed tranny work. It was the only one I ever changed the fluid in too. Never again. No way a trans should need a fluid change in 15000 miles.
Nonsense. You're still driving the same 60K miles between 90K and 150K, and you're still spending the same amount on the timing belt repair. The only difference is when you buy the belt. Either way, you're amortizing the same cost over the same mileage, and get the same cost per mile.
Those guys work on front ends/suspensions everyday. I've never had a problem with the place that I use. That is why I'm saying it was a faulty aftermarket wheel bearing and not the installer. It's a sealed bearing that has to be pressed into placed. It's not that big of a deal for someone that does it everyday. I would have replaced it myself if I had the tools.
And, they ALL try to sell you stuff. They always come out with a list of things that need to be replaced. Now, since I have been working on my own cars for over 30 yrs now, I KNOW what NEEDS to be replaced and what doesn't for the most part..
It's unfortunate for those that don't know what needs to be replaced and what does and just takes their word for it. Or, for those that can't do simple replacements themselves...like fan belts, hoses, brake pads, etc.
I was at a tire store just a few months ago and the guy comes out the the customer and tells her she needs new wiper blades. Don't remember what the cost was, but it was outrageous. I told the women to go to Autozone, buy the blades and they would install them free of charge.
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