heater inspection

[Ed Pawlowski]

e have limited inspection in CT. The accident rate is no worse than states that do inspections.

Responsible people get their car repaired. Irresponsible people find ways around the inspection.

[trader_4]

side and the car interior is set to 70? Must be a unique car.

This is shocking misinformation. Why in the world would any climate control or even manual AC be putting heat into the heater core unnecessarily while trying to cool the car? They're fighting for anything that can improve fu el economy and they have the heater core putting extra heat in the cabin? WTF? Why would they do that? And all it takes is to close a valve that's a lready there.

[gfretwell]

That was pretty much what Florida figured out 40 years ago. It did not have any noticeable effect on our accident rate either. Most accidents involve alcohol or general inattention anyway (phones, food/drink or screwing with electronic things on the dash), not equipment failure. As was pointed out here, most inspection these days is just dumping the codes on the computer anyway.

[Trumpster]

Inspections are just another government cash grab. All they do is waste our time and money.

Just another way for the government to take money from the taxpayers and give it to the lazy stupid democrats.

[RonNNN]

Without trying to step on any toes, I retired from automotive after over

45 years in the business over three years ago. I was just pointing out the simple fact that flow has nothing to do with whether a heater core will leak or not. I even almost suggested T-4 ask you, since they seem to take your word for all things relating to automotive.

[Ed Pawlowski]

In PA and MA that states get very little of the money. The real cash grab is the shoddy independent inspection shops. Yes, Mrs. Trumpster, your ball joints failed the inspection and it is dangerous to even drive home. For a mere $895 dollars we can fix it this afternoon.

[trader_4]

IDK what all cars do, but it seems highly illogical to try to regulate the cabin temp by having a heater core going at full blast all the time, even when the AC is on. The heater core is in the cabin, correct? Even if it's not directly in the air flow, you'd still have an enormous amount of heat generated by it in summer when the AC is on. Why would you make the AC work harder, eating up gas mileage when a simple valve can regulate the amount of heat from zero to max? And I know for sure late model BMWs use a coolant flow valve to the heater core, I've seen it with my own two eyes.

Maybe Clare can explain why this heat from an always on heater core isn't a problem and why it's a better design than a circuit with a simple solenoid valve.

[Vic Smith]

No it's not misinformation. Anybody who's ever replaced a heater core on GM vehicles that I know of, know that the core has an inlet and outlet and no valves restricting flow. It's the job of the mixer door to adjust heat in the cabin. There are some vehicles that have heater water valves, but I haven't worked on them. And their is no "extra" heat. Engine designers can't eliminate waste heat until they design one that's 100% efficient.

[trader_4]

:

rol or even manual AC be putting heat into the heater core unnecessarily wh ile trying to cool the car? They're fighting for anything that can improve fuel economy and they have the heater core putting extra heat in the cabin ? WTF? Why would they do that? And all it takes is to close a valve that' s already there.

GM vehicles that

ricting flow.

me vehicles that

If that heater core is in the cabin, which it is in every car I've ever worked on, then it is extra heat because it's 210F all the time. If you put a radiator in a box in your house, you don't think it would contribute to the AC load? And are you sure that there isn't a valve in those GM vehicles? It isn't typically right at the heater core, it's in the hose circuit under the hood. That is how it's done in BMW and MB.

100% efficient.

Which is irrelevant. I know the heat is free. It's the heat you don't want in the cabin when it's 85F outside and you have the AC on that's the issue. That is going to contribute to the AC load and pull down fuel economy, as I see it. And in the vehicles I've worked on, it hasn't been a problem, because there is a valve to regulate the heater core flow.

[Ed Pawlowski]

It has been probably 40 years since I played with heater cores, but I do know there was a valve in the line to stop the flow. Maybe thing have changed?

Google heater core valve and then click on images.

This is GM specific

[Vic Smith]

No, not for the heater cores I've replaced. I've changed the heater hoses too. The box is small and when the mixer door to it is closed there is no - or very minor - heat transfer to the cabin.

[Vic Smith]

Like I said, "There are some vehicles that have heater water valves, but I haven't worked on them." I've owned only Chevy cars and one van, and a Grand Am since about 1975. NONE of them had a heater valve. Nor did my 1966 F100 Ford PU, or 1973 Dart. Pretty sure you'll find that cars without heater water valves are as common as Chevys.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Looks like they have a valve

[trader_4]

Maybe you just need to look harder?

|Model%3AGrand+Am&epid=75725794&hash=item3f80cf7208:g:BhoAAOSwq7JUATWl&vxp=mtr

If you give us the year for the vehicles in question we can look at accurate part info. But just googling for Pontiac Grand Am, looking on Ebay, etc obviously at least some of them used heater valves.

[micky]

That would certainly be a good idea, but the Coopers Auto page doesn't list it. He lists wipers but not ws washers. (Nope, not listed. See link at bottom.)

Maybe it's not complete. I had tried to find the State of Maryland rules directly, but only found a 150 page pdf file. They should make it easier to find so people can do their own inspection beforee they take it, since they only get 30 days to finish once they start.

The last car the guy said I couldn't pass because of some oil dripping on the exhaust pipe. I don't see that on the list either. He passed me for an extra 10 or 20 dollars.

The inspection is only once, each time a car is sold used. Although if the police notice something from the list, they can make you fix it.

This is all I could find on a state webpage

:

Appendix A:

Vehicle Parts or Systems to be Inspected for passenger cars

Steering system ? Wheel alignment ? Suspension ? Brake system ? Wheels / tires ? Fuel system ? Exhaust system ? Bumpers ? Fenders ? Lights ? Electrical system ? Mirrors ? Glazing (windows) ? Wipers ? Hood / catches ? Door handle latches ? Floor / trunk pans ? Speedometer / odometer ? Driver seat ? Safety belts ? Motor mounts ? Gear shift indicator ? Universal and CV (constant velocity) joints ? Emissions equipment

Ah, here is the image of an actual Report checklist from 2010:

Maybe the standards were adopted before cars had defrosters. ;)

[gfretwell]

This has really drifted off topic Even if there was a valve, it only stops one direction of flow and since the system is pressurized a leak in the heater core would still drip, coming in from the other side. Yes I have had a leaking heater core and the only way to stop from steaming up the car is to pipe around the heater core as mentioned in a previous post. I got rid of my 75 Monza for exactly that reason. Replacing it would have involved removing the whole dash according to the Chevy dealer. It was OK all summer but I was not going into a DC winter without a heater.

[Vic Smith]

I'll repeat, "There are some vehicles that have heater water valves, but I haven't worked on them." Here's my Pontiac. 1995 Pontiac GT. 3.3 liter engine. Good luck finding the non-existant heater control valve. My 2003 Chevy Impala with the 3.4 likewise. Won't bother naming all the vehicles I've had with no heater control valve. All of them. A valve on a heater hose is too obvious to miss for anybody who works on their engines, and hose maintenance comes with the territory. I see the '66 F100 came equipped with one, but it was gone before I personally removed the 352 ci engine twice, replacing all hoses once. I never missed it.

[Ed Pawlowski]

When I lived in PA had many cars inspected. No one ever checked the defroster or the washers. One never checked brakes either.

I has a '64 Karmen Ghia convertible that I paid $15 for. The heat ducts were rusted out so no heat, no defrost. I used to carry a squeegee and an ice scraper. Many things on that car should never pass inspection, but I always had a sticker on it.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Sorry Vic, but I found it in less than a minute. Please, stop it. Cars have heater valves. Exception being air cooled engines. My Corvair and Karmen Ghias did not have them.

[trader_4]

I was trying to look up the specific part at part stores, but didn't get past that there is no 1995 Pontiac GT. Was that a Firebird Transam GT or something? I think you have to be careful with just general google searches because a lot of time they come back with hits for aftermarket things you could add, ie generic extra widgets, that are not part of the car.

From some other googling, I found at least one place that said that some cars do have the system these guys are talking about, where they just modulate the air flow and don't control the coolant flow. That kind of design doesn't make any sense to me for the reasons cited. But I still doubt Clare's position that the vast majority of cars are built that way now. Also, IDK what exactly "now" means. If this big shift has occurerd, I think it has to be only in much more recent years, not back in 1995. The designs I've seen, the air flowed through both the heating and cooling cores and the coolant through both cores mas modulated by valves according to need for heat or cooling.