# Do I really need 200 A main service?

Yep, I heard they were taking a big loss on each initially. Don't know if that's still true. And reports say that GM is only making \$1000 per Volt.

I'm only going by press reports. I don't trust them either.

EPA pegged the Volt at 60 MPG. I think gas powered it gets about 35 MPG. If your driving allows you to run all electric, then you can figure your "MPG" by converting charging costs to gasoline cost. We'll be hearing a lot about it in the next few years.
--Vic
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Here is one of the many articles regarding GM's claim of 230 MPG: http://gm-volt.com/2010/04/19/chevy-volts-230-mpg-rating-will-be-reduced/
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I saw that, but never believed those claims. The EPA at least gets close. Somebody here with good math skills can convert \$4.00 gas to the electric rate you would pay to get 230 MPG. But even then they better lower the Volt range to 35 miles, which is what real world tests say it gets - without A/C or heat running. Like I said, given my driving needs it would work for me. But not at the current price. I only spent more than \$3500 on a car once in my 63 years. I'll never own a Volt. Plenty of others will if it succeeds.
--Vic
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That would be "than"...signifies "degree" or "comparison". JFYI
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That would be "than"...signifies "degree" or "comparison". JFYI
LOL, you should see what it looked like before I hit the spell check
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On 12/5/2010 10:46 AM, Bob Villa wrote:

I'd like to own a RWD V-8 again before they outlaw them.... Sadly, other than maybe in a used beater pickup (which I don't have anyplace to park, and can't justify the dollars for the 3 times a year I NEED a pickup), they are already out of my price range. :^(
Probably best that I ain't rich. Gas prices are doing the 3 steps forward, 2 steps back routine around here for the last few months, and just passed north of 3 bucks a gallon again. I hope we don't get north of 4 bucks a gallon again anytime soon, but I am not optimistic.
--
aem sends...

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Funny today, maybe no so ten years from now. I read that California is installing thousands of charging stations now. That is keeping some electricians busy.
I'd put one in if I was buying a Tesla. You won't catch me driving a Volt even though the payback is a mere 18 years or so.
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I think you hit the nail on the head. California is just putting more nails in their financial coffin, but for those of us living in the real world, the volt is a POS, and we can't afford the Tesla. I don't think I'll have to worry about installing piles of electric car outlets for a while yet

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It would seem that if and when electric cars become feasible and cost effective for many people that you could upgrade your electric service at that time. I don't see why anyone would be laying out money today to go from a 150A service to 200A service on the theory that electric cars are going to become mainstream. No one knows exactly how the future of car technology is going to play out. That Chevy Volt would have to sell for under \$20K to be in line with similar compact cars. Then you still have the 40 mile electric range, but with the backup gas engine it could be suitable for commutes to the train or bus, short hops around town, etc.
For the OP, it would seem the simplest thing to do would be to try the existing service with the addition and see if it works out OK. If the main breaker starts tripping, then he knows he needs a larger service.
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It would seem that if and when electric cars become feasible and cost effective for many people that you could upgrade your electric service at that time. I don't see why anyone would be laying out money today to go from a 150A service to 200A service on the theory that electric cars are going to become mainstream. No one knows exactly how the future of car technology is going to play out. That Chevy Volt would have to sell for under \$20K to be in line with similar compact cars. Then you still have the 40 mile electric range, but with the backup gas engine it could be suitable for commutes to the train or bus, short hops around town, etc.
For the OP, it would seem the simplest thing to do would be to try the existing service with the addition and see if it works out OK. If the main breaker starts tripping, then he knows he needs a larger service.
I agree. The only thing that's wrong with the electric car, is the only thing that has always been wrong with it. The Battery. With all the devices using batteries today, I don't think some new, totally revolutionary battery technology is just going to sneak up on us. And if it did, I, and everyone else would be happy as clams... and then we wouldn't have enough electricity generation to feed them.
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At this point, this administration is still trying to pay people to buy them. Not to mention that this administration is buying something like 25% of them itself. At some point, if some manufacturer builds one good enough to be sold purely on it own merits, without subsidies, then they'll find a way to tax them, my guess is by a per mile tax.
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The house already passed the cap and tax plan to equalize the utility rates. Maybe the Senate can kill and it won't be brought back up in the new house.
But rest assured they will find a way to tax it if electric autos become a lasting reality.
Colbyt
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As they should. Someone has to pay for the roads. Who better than the users?
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Who better to pay for the roads? I see it this way. The municipal governments pay for maintaining the roads, then they put another chunk of money into trying to set up urban mass-transit. They've got it all wrong. They are subsidizing the oil companies by repairing the roads that are being used by their customers. Let the oil companies pay for the roads. And hey, the U.S. owns about 40% of GM, let GM be turning out cablecars.
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On 12/5/2010 10:32 PM, Michael B wrote:

Oh, grow up. You can't put a streetcar track down EVERY street, even in dense urban areas. Roads will ALWAYS be needed. Even where mass transit passes the common-sense test, the cheapest solution is almost always rubber-tired bus service. Steel wheels only make sense on high-volume, high-traffic corridors.
Standard disclaimer- if the buses ran out this far, and went where I needed to go, I would ride them. I did in college, and liked it a lot. But I'm not gonna freeze my ass off downtown waiting for a transfer, or take an hour each way getting to work, when I can drive it in 12 minutes on a bad day.
-- aem sends...
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Actually, I agree with you. And know that places like London have their act together, but it'll eventually show up here. They have a BIG tax on the gas, it goes to setting up and maintaining mass transit, and just to "encourage" its use, they have a "congestion tax" of 14 pounds or so for driving in the deep urban services district. Most bus companies are just doing the dance. In London they don't have bus schedules, they have maps. Even if you just missed it, there will be another within 15 minutes. At least, that was our experience. Wait till gas gets to \$5 a gallon, I'll still drive to the Home Depot and back. Because it's simply not practical to do it otherwise. But when/if it's \$10 a gallon, I'll consider the bus.
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On Sun, 5 Dec 2010 20:11:49 -0800 (PST), Michael B

Gas here in Ontario was up over \$1.12 per liter on the weekend. That's something like \$4.23 a US Gallon.
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Or bike it in 15 on a good day.
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On 12/6/2010 8:07 PM, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

For a young jock, maybe. For a fat old fart like me, not much faster than walking. 7.6 miles, about half uphill. Even 20 years ago when my knees and butt were in better shape, I'd have to walk it up a couple of those hills. With the traffic and idiot drivers on the roads in question, I want steel around me. Not to mention, of course, that this is frigging Michigan, and winter is 5+ months long here. Only a fool rides a bike in traffic on a dark road.
The bus used to run to the apartments I lived in before I bought this house, about 3/4 a crow mile closer to work. I rode it a few times when car was in the shop. 2-3 of those times, I got tired of waiting for the transfer bus, and walked the last 3/4 mile uphill to the office. Bus system in this town is dying- they have collapsed the routes back to the ones that had any actual ridership, mainly in the older poorer parts of town.
--
aem sends...

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