Ground Beef Recall Expanded

[Janet Baraclough]

The message from "JoeSpareBedroom" contains these words:

Both eggs AND dairy are dietary sources of vit B12,

See

Both say the same. Quote from above, read to end.

" Dietary Sources The only reliable unfortified sources of vitamin B12 are meat, dairy products and eggs. There has been considerable research into possible plant food sources of B12. Fermented soya products, seaweeds and algae have all been proposed as possible sources of B12. However, analysis of fermented soya products, including tempeh, miso, shoyu and tamari, found no significant B12.

Spirulina, an algae available as a dietary supplement in tablet form, and nori, a seaweed, have both appeared to contain significant amounts of B12 after analysis. However, it is thought that this is due to the presence of compounds structurally similar to B12, known as B12 analogues. These cannot be utilised to satisfy dietary needs. Assay methods used to detect B12 are unable to differentiate between B12 and it's analogues, Analysis of possible B12 sources may give false positive results due to the presence of these analogues.

Researchers have suggested that supposed B12 supplements such as spirulina may in fact increase the risk of B12 deficiency disease, as the B12 analogues can compete with B12 and inhibit metabolism.

The current nutritional consensus is that no plant foods can be relied on as a safe source of vitamin B12. "

end quote.

Janet

[JoeSpareBedroom]

I'm not debating that. I'm just responding to the use of the word "dairy" to describe eggs.

[Jangchub]

Yes, if you read my post stream I clearly said enriched when making reference to foods. I am not vegan, but the only thing I continue to do which would make me NOT a vegan would be dairy and eggs. I am weaning off them. Cows never eat a piece of meat and they become the meat we eat to get what? Grass and corn (which cattle don 't eat in nature) turn into red meat. I don't think any meat humans eat are anything other than herbivores. Go figure.

[Jangchub]

Actually, I originally said "lacto/ovo" which is the term. I know many vegetarians who do not eat eggs because they are considered black foods for certain spiritual paths.

[Omelet]

I use Solgar and "Now" brand a lot.

I'm wondering tho' where the B-12 is coming from?

If it is animal in source...

I'm not trying to be argumentative, I really am curious how you solve the dilemma. Meat is getting to be too expensive, but for the first time in my life I am NOT anemic! My Dr.s tell me it's due to my change in diet in eating low carb and including meat in every meal.

My grocery bills are cheaper if I eat more fresh produce. I just have to make sure that said produce is low in starch and sugar. (Not difficult if one knows about the nutritional content of various types of veggies).

Pasta and grain are out. Period. So is most fruit.

See the problem?

[Omelet]

origin.

And FORTIFIED veggie products.

Where is the B-12 coming from? If it is being fortified from an animal source, one may as well continue being lacto-ova.

One can raise their own chickens free range, and just not have a rooster. Sterile eggs are not killing anything.

The myth that eating cholesterol laden foods raises serum cholesterol was proven to be untrue a long, long time ago.

Unfortunately, many sources are still hanging on to that.

[Omelet]

That is why I mentioned Brewers Yeast.

As far as I've been able to find, it is the ONLY unfortified plant source of that very vital vitamin.

As for B12 supplements giving you the runs? There are sometimes other things in supplements. ;-) Might want to try another brand before discounting it.

Solgar VM-75 is high in B-complex and is an excellent supplement brand to consider.

[Omelet]

I'm not irritated. ;-) I see exactly where you are coming from. The USDA allows given amounts of "coliform" bacteria in our foods as well as bug parts and rodent feces.

I see no way to totally avoid that short of raising ALL of your own food.

I just try not to think about it.

Except that due to the fact that we use shit as fertilizer means that it's going to be on your plant based foods as well. Bagged salad greens have killed more people than contaminated meat has.

You can't win that one. Sorry!

Raise your own veggies hydroponically so that they never have contact with dirt if you are really serious.

There are some hydroponic veggies available at the store. My favorite Boston Butter lettuce is sold that way, but it's slightly over $3.00 per head.

Whatever works for you babe... :-)

I'd prefer to avoid GMO foods too. I just don't trust them... I have too many food allergies as it is.

[Omelet]

Did you stop to consider tho' that the B12 in that vitamin pill is still coming from an animal source?

[Omelet]

Jangchub.

Please take a look at some of Stammet's research on wood consuming mushrooms. It might be helpful.

His books are available on this website:

appear to contain natural anti-viral properties.

Shitake mushroom is a good place to start and iirc, turkey tail is another. It's been awhile since I read his stuff... but they (him and his staff) also respond well to e-mails.

Hope this helps?

We may not always agree on everything, but I still like you. ;-)

A very good liver support herbal is Milk Thistle, widely available at the health food stores. It appears to help the liver to detox more easily. It's widely used (successfully) by alcoholics.

[Omelet]

They do.

[Ann]

Billy expounded:

You have no idea who she is or how long she's been here: clue: she's been here since 1995. People here could say that you (or me, or anyone else) is a waste of time, too.

Which is as long as you've been around (a pittance compared to many), and for that year we've had to listen to your constant political rants. Many of your posts have nothing to do with gardening, why are you complaining when another member talks about non-gardening related issues? You can chit-chat with your friends but determine who else can do the same?

No, she's sharing with those of us who know her how she's doing. How small-minded must you be to sit in a newsgroup and take pot-shots at someone who is ill....someone you don't know and have no idea who she is or what's she's been through.

I doubt it.

[Omelet]

I buy chinese rice.

It's cheaper.

[Omelet]

We don't have good, reliable public transportation. The US is also a MUCH bigger country than any one European country.

The North also gets more snow.

With the current price of gas, I'd be delighted to use it if it was available.

I am looking forward to the lite rail that will be going between Austin and San Antonio in a few years.

Betcha I plan to use that thing!!!

[Ann]

enigma expounded:

That's a huge problem for many of us in the eastern/metro/Boston sorta area. There isn't much public transportation. I'm fortunate in that now there's a rail line that runs through my town right into Boston, so I can go to Braintree, Quincy, etc. via railroad, but I can't get to Brockton, or out to the western part of the state, nor can I easily go north past Boston, without switching around on the T, etc. It's not easy to get around this area without a car.

[Ann]

Omelet expounded:

I'm taggon on to Om's post - these are excellent suggestions. I think V has alreayd tried milk thistle, but I may be wrong....

I am taking a balanced B Complex that is 100% whole foods from Megafoods to see if it helps the thyroid condition I've developed (hyperactive). It seems to be working, along with soy lethecin capsules and a thyroid support supplement I found from a Canadian company. Long term stress can do nasty things to your thyroid as I have found out :o(

[Ann]

Omelet expounded:

Be careful. They're using nasty things all over the place in China nowadays to increase production (as we well know!)

[Janet Baraclough]

The message from Omelet contains these words:

Even if you raie your own, and feed your soil entirely on composted vegetable matter, you still won't avoid coliforms, insect parts, and rodent faeces. Wherever we grow food it will attract other species to feed, bugs insects and worms, to feed on your crops, seeds, live and dead leaves etc, and birds, rodents etc which feed on the insects, bugs, worms etc.

If you raise veg hydroponically, you will have to add chemical nutrients to their watersystem. Some of those have been obtained from animal waste (urea, nitrogen etc), and you will STILL get rodents, insects etc attracted to the water, crops, nutrients etc.

Janet

[Cheryl Isaak]

And even then, birds and bugs still poop! LOL!

Yup!

[Janet Baraclough]

The message from Omelet contains these words:

I suppose you know the rural Chinese never waste human manure...

Janet