TS-Aligner Fall 2006 Promotional Offer!

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Hi Folks,
To show my appreciation to the wreck for all your help and support I thought I would do something completely different this year.
How about a HALF PRICE sale!
Well, there are some strings attached...
First, I'm only offering one particular configuration of TS-Aligner Jr. at half price (top teir dealer pricing). It's not a stripped down model but it's also not a premium version. You get the complete TS-Aligner Jr. with the Storage Case and the DVD but only one choice of dial indicator: the standard MHC brand:
http://www.ts-aligner.com/optional-indicators.htm#Standard
No other parts or accessories or configurations are included in this offer. The units will be brand new with the standard warranty and everything.
Second, you have to buy a whole case of Jr's at once (16 units) - all shipped to a single address. So, the offer isn't such a great deal for someone who doesn't belong to a group or doesn't have any friends. But, this is rec.woodworking. If you are reading this message then you are already part of a really big group! All you guys have to do is decide which of you is trustworthy enough to organize the purchase and distribute the Aligners when they come in.
Third, the offer has a specific and limited duration. It will start on November 1, 2006 and end on December 31, 2006.
Early Bird Ebay Offer:
As an experiment I have put up one case of these TS-Aligner Jr's on Ebay. If you want, you can get a jump on the promotion by taking advantage of it. It is item #150051217493. Look here for all the details:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item 0051217493&ssPageName­ME:L:DSS:US:11
Please let me know if you have any questions or comments. If you think the group would benefit from the answer please feel free to post your question/comment here. It would also make sense to use this thread to organize your purchase(s). I will post a message to this thread on November 1 with the URL of the page where cases of Jr's can be purchased online. I will also be posting reminders to this thread throughout the promotion to make sure that everyone who visits the wreck gets a chance to see it.
Thanks, Ed Bennett snipped-for-privacy@ts-aligner.com
http://www.ts-aligner.com Home of the TS-Aligner
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WTF is this???????? Sounds - Looks - Walks, like SPAM!
| | http://www.ts-aligner.com | Home of the TS-Aligner |
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Mr Bennett contributes here and provides technical expertise into the precise alignment of tools. If technical expertise and meaningful discussions offend you, please go elsewhere.
He is elsewhere in this newsgroup right now offering assistance to somebody who who damaged his tablesaw. Have you made an expert contribution to that thread?
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One of the things that has completely ruined other "hobby" type newsgroups that I've spent years on has been people trying to make a profit from the group. What happens is that the number of profiteers increases over time. The group then turns into nothing but a bunch of marketers and is no longer useful to anyone in the hobby. Fights erupt when multiple people try to market the same product or when someone profits off the free advice of another. Marketers then become less "hobbiest" and more business men.
I really hope this group doesn't degrade into that because I've already left two hobbies behind that have gone that route. I mention this for everyone to consider. If there is no line drawn then ads from every marketer of woodworking products will flood this group. I've watched it happen. What's the difference between the OP and incra, delta or any other manufacturer? I also think the OP was pretty bold to suggest that we all pull together in order to make a bulk purchase. A purchase that would basically send $1K+ in his direction. This is also a practice I've seen in the two forementioned newsgroups.
I don't mind it when people who have products to sell come here to exchange ideas and talk about woodworking. I'd just rather see them limit their marketing to their own website. A hyperlink in your signature is a lot less intrusive and would be less likely to offend people than a blatant advertisement.
That's my .02 worth.
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elswhere.
Maybe the basketweaving and cross stitching newsgroups can meet your high standards of non involvement.
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Lee Michaels wrote:

Never said I personally was offended but I can tell you that I won't buy Ed's product based solely on the fact that he's taking advantage of this forum to make a buck. I achieve the same thing at a much lower cost anyway.

Whitewater Kayaking and Unicycling. Arcade Collecting is getting real close to being worthless too.
There's no purpose in being synical about someone pointing out a problem that is bound to become worse. I was trying to offer something constructive while you obviously responded for the sake of criticizing me. It would be nice to see some positive responses instead, such as starting a group for woodworking vendors. If I wanted to look for woodworking products (or spam) then I could go to that group and browse. Instead I have to keep updating kill filters.
I realize that's the nature of usenet today but that's not the original intent of it. I worked on the usenet software back in the early 80's when I was a Marine. We were trying to take what Duke and Chapel Hill had done and create an equivalent for the military. The purpose was to allow people to educate and collaborate. The usenet of today is quickly morphing from its root purpose into a system that's destined to be inundated with commercial interests. The end result is that the original purpose is not only lost but ceases to exist.
My original post in this thread was a "heads up" of what's to come and a suggestion that the money makers respect the purpose of the group. The responses I received from members were expected as this is exactly what's happened along the way as other groups have deteriorated.
Doug Miller wrote:

It's interesting that you speak for what you suggest is "the majority" and categorize me as "the minority". I didn't realize you were president of this here usenet group. You must be a real important guy - much more important than anyone else here. After all, you get to decide who is more important than who. Perhaps you could share your "org" chart with me so I can figure out where I fit in.
I didn't see a large number of responses for or against commercial advertisements, which makes it impossible to determine what the minority or majority thinks about the issue. Your attempt to minimize my involvement and interest in woodworking has nothing to do with facts. But your response is familiar. Exactly what I've seen in other groups before they stopped being a place for hobbiests to meet.
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< snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com

Oh my god, I am being taken advantage of. I was not aware of this.
And the folks who come by and help us are entitled to make a buck. They listen to us and we listen to them. And Ed's product, in particular, came about to meet a need. And he has helped a lot of people learn about tuning their saws.
The wreck would be a droll place if only folks with home shops just came here. The professionals add a lot of expertise and knowledge to this forum. And some of them even make a dreaded buck or two.
A tradtional rule in web forums is that it is spamming if you contribute nothing. It ain't if you participate in a manner where expertise and knowledge is communicated. Perhaps you have difficulty with the concepts of communication, expertise and knowledge.

I am being "synical"??? You are offering constructive criticism?? I am OBVIOUSLY responding in this fashion "for the sake of criticizing you". It must be tough living in a world where everything happens because of YOU.
I place a high value on information, creativity solutions to problems. I don't discriminate on the basis of race, religion, politics or the fact they may be be involved in a dreaded business. If the can help, inform or entertain me, I appreciate and accept them. It is that simple.
One of the biggest impediments to using the web to its fullest is all the whining net nannies. Since it is a great burden to updating your kill filters to filter out all knowledgable people, I will try to help. I will killfile you so as to not have to deal with your constant whining. There, feel better?

Gee, the world is changeing. Does your whining help bring back the good old days?
It may come as a great shock to you. but many people find the wreck to be just fine. Even if it does not achieve some utopian ideal of yours.

You really have a thing for "money makers" don't you? Is it beyond your comprehension that people can come together for a common benefit. And even include a few of these dreaded "moneymakers".
I am here to tell you that these so called "moneymakers" have contributed much to this newsgroup. We don't need your warnings of doom and gloom.
That is all I am going to say about this.
Into the bozo bucket for you.

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On Wed, 1 Nov 2006 12:37:23 -0500, "Lee Michaels"

To Todd:
You make some good, and IMHO, valid points. They may not be applicable in this particular case, but that's a judgment call. In general, they are very good points. This is an unmoderated group and, as such, there is some, not a lot, but some spam in this group.
A true spammer will just drop off the s**t and be gone. In this instance, I don't believe that to be the case. But, that's just my observation. I think most inhabitants of the Wreck just ignore the spam, as they try, all too often unsuccessfully, to ignore the trolls that crop up on occasion.
As you've undoubtedly noticed, there are some who feel awfully paternalistic, defensive and, dare I say, possessive, toward the Wreck. But, as it should be obvious to all, you are as much an "owner" of the Wreck as anyone else who's here.
Oh, BTW, Semper Fi! I was there in the 60's, and there are a several others of us around.
To Lee:
You also, make some valid points. But "whining"? I didn't see that. Neither do I see a need to block your posts simply because of the ad hominem contribution to this thread.
To All,
"But you must remember, my fellow-citizens, that eternal vigilance by the people is the price of liberty, and that you must pay the price if you wish to secure the blessing. It behooves you, therefore, to be watchful ...." -- Andrew Jackson, Farewell Address, March 4, 1837
And, if I may add to Jackson's words, it serves no good purpose to attack the watcher when an alarm is raised. Much better to simply, and dispassionately, educate the watcher if the alarm is false.
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OTOH, when the watcher continues to yammer after attempts have been made to educate him...
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
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snipped-for-privacy@milmac.com (Doug Miller) wrote in Tom Veatch

MY ignore button works well...
Patriarch
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Patriarch wrote:

Which the TS-Aligner objector could choose to employ, if they were reasonable.
--
Dave
www.davebbq.com
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On Wed, 01 Nov 2006 21:17:47 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@milmac.com (Doug Miller) wrote:

Then, I suppose it becomes a case of "What do you do after you 'turn the other cheek'. Walk away, or call in an air strike?" :)
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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

What a patronizing pant-load of crap. Ed's been around the wreck far longer than you and is quite generous with help and advice. So your "prediction" that Ed is the harbinger of the wreck's downfall is nonsense.

That is the type of response on would expect from someone who thinks the world revovles around them.

In *your* opinion you don't see the responses as positive. And you are free to start any kind of group you wish.

Yup, as I said, you think things should revolve around *your* wishes and desires. But please continue. Now, share some stories about your long-time experience with usenet that makes you special. Go on, don't be bashful.

Just a sec......<brush, brush, brush, ACHOO, sniff, cough> Sorry; those tales of yore sure stir up a lot of dust when dragged out of storage.

Sure, that's the explanation. Or maybe it's that Ed is seen as one of our own and you are viewed as a meddling outsider?

Now that is clever. I've never heard that line before.

Truly spoken by someone who seems to have trouble fitting in.

Doug has been around for quite awhile and knows -- from experience -- the temperament of the wreck and Ed's contributions here. That does make it possible for him to know.

I just love the tone of hyperbole in the morning. It sounds like..... like.......whining.
--
Dave
www.davebbq.com
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My comments are based on observing the number of people who support Ed and his (actually infrequent) posts here, and those like yourself who oppose his doing so. On that basis, you *are* in a small minority.

As opposed to yourself, who thinks he should get to decide who's allowed to post, and post what, here...
I'm not trying to "decide who is more important than who". My statement is clearly labelled as my _opinion_. That's what "it seems to me" means.
Seems I was right, too.

Guess.
I made no comments at all about your "involvement and interest in woodworking". I merely offered my opinion on your value to the group, relative to Ed Bennett's.
Seems I was right, too.

Of course you're free to leave whenever you wish. Some folks may try to talk you into staying.
Some won't.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
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Doug Miller wrote:

Not mention that Ed has a Cabal card...
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B A R R Y wrote:
>>Doug Miller wrote:

Shhh.....there is NO Cabal.
--
Dave
www.davebbq.com
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Dave Bugg wrote:

Joe
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Joe Gorman wrote:

How long ago did you bake them? I thought membership was closed many years ago.
Now, where did I put that darn card...
Ed
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snipped-for-privacy@ts-aligner.com wrote:

lost in the mail. Joe checking seals on PTM
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Joe Gorman wrote:

Never speak of the brownies!
Or the Cool-Aid....
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