spoke shave parts

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I recently bought a Stanley #151 spoke shave, but it is missing the blade and the cap iron. Anyone have suggestions for finding replacements? (An unscrupulous eBayer sold it as being in "excellent condition"; photo was poor and I didn't think to ask about all the parts being there![&@#%&!] I'm in negotiations, but in case I choose to keep it I'd like to fix it.)
Dan
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snipped-for-privacy@gte.net (Dan Cullimore) wrote in www.supertool.com, everything Stanley, and lots of everything else.
I've worked with both of these folks. They both have excellent reputations.
Have fun with the shave!
Patriarch, no affiliation, etc.....
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snipped-for-privacy@gte.net (Dan Cullimore) wrote in message

You might want to try calling Lori in Parts at Stanley Works at 800-262-2161. (I don't know if that number is still current, but it's the last one I've got.) She tends to go above-and-beyond in getting parts to needy galoots.
Chuck Vance
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On 22 Jun 2004 21:54:00 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@gte.net (Dan Cullimore) wrote:

Dan,
Since you need a blade anyway, you might give some thought to replacing with a Hock blade. If you don't want to do that, I may have a stock Stanley blade still laying around from when I put in the Hock. If you go with the Hock, be aware that it is thicker than the stock blade and may require a little filing on the bed to make room for the extra thickness. That is not all bad since most of those shaves could use a little smoothing and flattening on the bed anyway.
If you want me to check around for that extra blade drop me an email. The reply-to address is good.
Tom Veatch Wichita, KS USA
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On 22 Jun 2004 21:54:00 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@gte.net (Dan Cullimore) wrote:

A #151 is rubbish anyway, As described in Fine Woodworking a while back, the blades won't hold an edge and the cap iron isn't accurate enough to hold it down well. Brian Boggs described how to improve the mouth and bedding with epoxy, then make a brass cap iron.
But this is clearly the seller's fault, so have them take it back and give you a full refund. Mis-descriptions are one thing, but half of it missing is quite another.
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<snip>
That sounds interesting. Is it in a book, web page, or a message in the archives? Give me a hint as where to start looking?
Tom Veatch Wichita, KS USA
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On Thu, 24 Jun 2004 02:07:41 +0000, Tom Veatch wrote:

FWW #158, Oct 2002. Probably available at your local library.
--
Joe Wells


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Thanks, Joe. That issue is still available from Taunton as a "back issue". Got one on its way to my mailbox. That's probably faster (and considering fuel prices, probably about as cheap) than me fighting downtown traffic to get to the library. Besides, some of the other articles look interesting, also.
Tom Veatch Wichita, KS USA
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(Dan Cullimore)

Andy: Could you identify the issue, (or especially anything about tuning up this "rubbish")? I'd like to read the piece. I'm considering Tom's suggestion about a Hock blade, but I'd like to get (or make) a cap iron. Thanks, Dan
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snipped-for-privacy@gte.net (Dan Cullimore) wrote in message

The #151 just isn't a high quality piece. The main problem is poor fit between the mouth and cap iron, so there's a lack of rigidity in holding the iron (do shaves have blades or irons ?) and that leads to chatter. I've never seen the point in the knuckle-ripper screws either. I adjust them by laying them face down on a sheet or two of paper and gauging depth by finger pressure on the back of the iron.
The irons are also poor. A new Hock is a good idea here (or they're not a bad place to learn blade making and heat treatment)
There are several things to do with a #151:
- Throw it away. Like many people, I've collected loads of this pattern but never use them. I much prefer the #63 / #64 Stanley spokeshaves (flat and curved base). These are smaller (sometimes described as the "child's model") but they also have a simpler design that's less affected by lack of rigidity. I also like wooden spokeshaves, because of the different geometry, and this includes the modern Lee Valley version. I've also got an old #53 - don't know much about these, haven't really used it yet - but it looks promising.
- Get a decent one. The things are only a few bucks on eBay. It's really just not worth chasing after fixing a bad one. I also have examples with the commonplace broken handles. Although I have welded them to repair them, this is definitely as cast-iron welding practice, not as an economically sensible repair. I just want to improve my skills for fixing all those #10s 8-)
- Fix it. The Brian Boggs' piece made me laugh - he basically throws away everything except the handle and the clamp screw, and he reworks the handles pretty extensively. I'm sure it's a good tool when he's done, but it surely has to be easier to get a decent #151 pattern one from Lee Valley.

Making a cap iron is very simple metalworking. The article described using a woodworking bandsaw for cutting out brass. Personally I'd not do that - hacksawing by hand is less work than cleaning brass chips out of my woodworking kit.
The only complex part was using epoxy to build up the bed of the main body part. Those who shoot target rifles will be familiar with this process.
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Excellent info, thanks. Alex
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It may be rubbish, but there's been a lot of chairs made using them (and blue handled Marples chisels too).
Just keep your tools sharp and work the wood.
FWIW, I'd send the junk back to the ebay seller and buy a complete spoke shave.

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Andy Dingley wrote:

The #53 is a decent shave. It's got the adjustable mouth (toe-piece, really), so it can be set for fine work. It was my first "favorite" shave (before I made a couple of Guntershaves and got my hands on the two Lee Valley shaves).

Yep. They've already done all the work, plus you get a nice beefy iron. They also provide you with shims for closing up the mouth.
Personally, if I had it to do over again, I'd buy the LV low-angle and #151 and pass on the other metal shaves.
Chuck Vance
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Lowell: Why I won't send it back: I didn't pay much for it; I don't trust the seller for the refund ("once burned..."), and especially not the full shipping (which was more than the tool!); I like a challenge, and Stanley is sending the parts as I type (Conan is right about that Lori--she IS good). (The seller did offer a refund, but I'm still PO'd by the way she set the auction. I won't return it, but will be honest in my feedback. I've said my piece to the seller.)
Andy: Thanks for the useful critique, and the heads up about the FWW issue. Having never used a spoke shave I'll just have to see about how much rubbish I have when/if I get it working.
Joe: Thanks for the citation info.
Tom: Thanks for the generous offer and other info.
All: I really appreciate the critical and experienced perspectives on what shaves are worth having and why. I've thought of making my own, and will probably do so in the next few weeks, but thought it would be good to try a ready-made first, thus the eBay bid; I was surprised I won. I have also thought of making my own blade(s), but don't quite have the shop space or time just yet. I'm also more interested in building a boat.
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Did you find out if they have an improved lever cap for it? And what are all the parts you ordered?
Reason I ask is I have a resource for a #51 and a #151 for cheap.
Alex
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I still think the best deal for a 'new spokeshave user' is to get one (or more) from Lee Valley. No fiddling. Just clean off the protective goop, hone the blade, and go. Oh, and you can trust the seller.
Unless what you really want to do is restore an old tool...
Patriarch
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just be sure it is the low angle one. Or better yet the wooken kit.
-- J G (thewoodworkerformerlyknownhereasspokehave)
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<snippage>

I'm willing to learn from a master. Why do you say that?
Patriarch
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"patriarch snipped-for-privacy@nospam.comcastDOTnet>" <<patriarch> wrote in message

I am but a humble deciple of the ways of the NeaderDude

Because they simplay kick ass. There is no way, NO WAY you are going to get the same quality cut from a "stanley type"spokeshave as you would from a traditional low-angle spokeshave especially on endgrain.
try it you'll like it: http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.asp?SID=&ccurrency=2&pageD834&category=1,49601 http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.asp?SID=&ccurrency=&pageI710&category=1,49601
-- J G NeanderShill
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I agree that the LV spkeshaves are good things. I own the Low Angle, and the pair of wooden handled jewels that Robin introduced last winter. They were also on the benches at the College of the Redwoods, when we visited the shop in February, for the winter student show. 'I' like them, but I am in NO WAY an expert in things Neander. A wanna-be neophyte, as it were.
My question was, perhaps unclear. If you were to recommend a 'starter shave' of the LV group, what would it be, and why?
BTW, your plans for a spokeshave are squirreled away on my hard drive somewhere, for a future winter evenings' project. You can always use one more good one, right?
Patriarch
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