Refurbished Unisaws

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Visit your local thrift shop - it may be used but usually is still in good working order and you will benefit the group that they are supporting. . .
BB
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BB said:

Do you really want to buy used underwear? I mean, someone else's 'boys' have been in there... ;-)
There may be a law that prohibits selling used underwear, I've never seen any - but I could be wrong. Perhaps it's that no one buys it so they don't bother putting it out.
Greg G.
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You had been talking about a TOASTER. . .
BB
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BB said:

OK - I get it now. But you posted the comment under the underwear portion. At least I got a good laugh out of it.
Actually, when I lived in Florida, I frequented the local Salvation Army and Goodwill stores quite a bit - not for cloths, but hardware. Unfortunately, I rarely found anything worth buying. There are no stores near where I live now - and it would require a trip into downtown - a place I try my best to never go.
Greg G.
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Edwin Pawlowski said:

OK, Off Topic Crap. But...
While I have been verbally lamenting the loss of US industry, don't get the idea I am a Nationalist. I buy products from Germany, Italy, France, England and even Japan and other developed, economically mature countries without *too* much chagrin.
What I resent is the unlevel playing field that Chinese products represent, and the total collapse of our own industries as a result.
I have no problem with the Chinese people, but I do not trust the Government nor their intentions. Their quiet build up of arms and technology, continuing human rights issues, environmental chaos, and their not so secret desire to become a world empire once again leads me to believe that our pandering is a bad thing for us and the world in general.
And they certainly have no intention of ever buying our products in an open marketplace - they shun ours and develop their own. A few examples:
DVDs? No way, the Chinese government promoted the internal development of CVD and refuses to enforce foreign copyrights.
Cars? Ha! Don't even go there, we can't even sell them to Americans.
Machinery? Well, we don't make anything anymore - other than military weapons. The Japanese have dominated the robotics industry. And they already make everything else.
Computer Software? Double Ha-Ha. Bill Gates is fuming at this very minute - millions of bootleg copies of Windows are in use already. And, they have developed their own Linux based O.S.
What is left to sell them? Food? I bought a gallon bottle of apple juice at Kroger the other day, and on the side of the bottle, in tiny little letters, was stamped "Imported from China". I took it back and raised hell. The last thing I'm going to drink is a cadmium, mercury, PCB, etc. filled bottle of apple juice from China.
And why didn't we embrace the Russians with as much zeal as we have the Chinese? After all, they attempted to embrace democracy and capitalism, and we snubbed them. And as a result, arms and nuclear materials have spread worldwide, and they are near chaos. Not very good democracy building, if you ask me... Even though the old Soviet blok countries are inching forward, with companies like Groz and such, they certainly haven't received the economic boost we handed China.
While I'm obviously not a foreign affairs guru, it makes me wonder what the hell we are doing - Well, actually I do know... $$$$$$$$$ Avarice reigns supreme. :-\
Greg G.
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"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message

We've a Prestige 'Aroma', dual, non sissy, full Monte, four banger bagel toaster for about four years that I thought was a pretty damn good toaster because that sucker has a timer SO F**&ING GOOD that it pops up PERFECTLY toasted bread the EXACT _same_ second that my two morning eggs are done to perfection!!
... until I read your post, that is. I just turned the damn thing over (spreading crumbs all over the place in the process ... thanks a lot) and DAMN me if it ain't <gasp> "Made in China"!
Now I feel screwed, despite the fact it's performed flawlessly for all that time.
Jeeeezuss, what's this country coming to?!?
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/05
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Swingman (in 882dnXJ4fJ7ea snipped-for-privacy@giganews.com) said:
| Jeeeezuss, what's this country coming to?!?
You made me look. The kitchenAid (a Whirlpool brand) on our counter claims to come from St. Joseph, Michigan. I have another in my consulting kit that I bought in a Philly WalMart for $14.95 (along with a similarly priced rice cooker) that I can't imagine coming from fron anywhere other than China.
The KitchenAid toaster has an LED "toastedness" display, but doesn't do a noticably better job (repeatable result, even-toasting, etc) than the $85-cheaper Chinese product. Both of 'em are a PIA when it comes to emptying the crumbs [thank you very much for the reminder!]
But the only conclusion that this discussion leads to is that some Chinese factories can produce _some_ things less-expensively than American factories can. If you're a toaster production line assembly person being paid $20/hour (based on seniority) to put the four bottom screws through the plastic feet, that's probably disturbing.
The word "some" above is important. There's stuff _not_ coming out of Chinese factories yet that _is_ produced here. We can either complain about how they've learned to do some of the things that we learned sooner, or we can focus on providing the world with the things that they can't produce less expensively (yet).
The really important question has to be: Is there a scenario in which everyone does that business activity they do best so as to produce a synergy of American and Chinese (and ...) efforts?
I'm fairly well convinced that win-lose strategies utlimately produce only lose-lose results.
It would seem that the world has shrunk to the point where we're obliged to start learning how to "play well with others" - and to remember that we don't own all the toys nor make all the rules.
Fortunately, excellence is still treasured everywhere.
-- Morris Dovey DeSoto Solar DeSoto, Iowa USA http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/solar.html
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"Morris Dovey" wrote in message

Did I mention that the Eureka "Boss" I used to suck up all those crumbs was 'Assembled in Mexico'?
--
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wrote:

I've seen tons of stuff labeled "packed in USA", on the box, and the device inside is labeled with the actual country of origin.
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Ba r r y (in snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com) said:
| On Sun, 30 Oct 2005 11:57:31 -0600, "Morris Dovey"
| || Swingman (in 882dnXJ4fJ7ea snipped-for-privacy@giganews.com) said: || ||| Jeeeezuss, what's this country coming to?!? || || You made me look. The kitchenAid (a Whirlpool brand) on our counter || claims to come from St. Joseph, Michigan. | | I've seen tons of stuff labeled "packed in USA", on the box, and the | device inside is labeled with the actual country of origin.
Me too. This was on the back of the toaster itself. The box is long gone.
-- Morris Dovey DeSoto Solar DeSoto, Iowa USA http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/solar.html
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Since toaster flipping is a popular hobby, I took a close look at mine. It does say KA in Michigan, but the bottom of the label also says Made in China. I'd be surprised if there are any made in the US in the past 10 years.
At work we pack a lot of products in large poly bags. The best thing to seal them with is a Teflon coated household iron. I buy Black & Decker. When I first started buying them 15 years ago, they were $20 to $23 (origins unknown). Now they are $13. What I don't understand is that I was willing to pay 20 bucks, so why go through a lot of contortions to sell them cheaper?
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Edwin Pawlowski said:

Cheaper, but higher profit margin. And you sell more of them, because they break more often.
Greg G.
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I've been looking to upgrade my TS for awhile now. I've been eyeing the 1023S for awhile, so when I saw your post asking about the Unisaw for $1299, my first thought was no, but I don't have experience with either to advise from actual use. Although, I did read some reviews from some very impressed people on Amazon regarding the 1023S, so I would have a hard time spending an extra $400 (or $375 for the SL) on a refurbished Unisaw.
Many of the pros here could probably justify the extra $400, but for my budding shop I'd rather put that extra $$ on a Grizzly 14" band saw.
There's delivery charges to consider as well. The local Unisaw dealer won't charge you freight.
JMHO
Jeff
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I used the older 70's vintage Unisaws in college and at a friend's shop. When I started shopping to upgrade to a cabinet saw 4-5 years ago I was pretty much predisposed to the Unisaw. After looking at newer Unisaws I decided to expand my search. They weren't what they used to be and frankly they haven't improved since (Handwheel brake nuts for example).
My final decision did come down to Unisaw, Grizzly 1023S and the Jets. The 1023 won based on value and the fact it reminded me so much of the earlier Unisaws. This included both visual and tactile impressions (smooth handwheels, tabletop machining/flatness, specifications, sound, vibration, etc.) I do believe the Unisaw is still a fine machine but I cannot personally justify the extra hundreds of dollars for the brand name. My machine has served me well for four years, requires very little adjustment, and Grizzly delivery support is great. I have never had to use their product support.
So There! RonB
BTW - Grizzly will probably provide the names of up to two recent customers, in your area, who have made recent purchases of a 1023 (and who have agreed to talk to folks like you). This service, plus a trip to the Springfield store, won me over.
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RonB said:

I hear ya - that funky T thing is a departure from the nice old knobs.

I hear you again! I've always wanted a Unisaw, but when it comes to laying out cold, hard cash - they worry me these days. Still, I prefer to buy American products and support my neighbors whenever possible - but I am tiring of being burned by that desire. It's getting to the point where when I see Made in USA, it's worse garbage than the Chinese crap - which is steadily improving.
I live in the SE, and there are no Grizzly dealers. Makes it more difficult to access their products. But the 1023 looks like a very nice machine.
Greg G.
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I have a Unisaw and I love it, but problems such as a warped extension table and slightly warped left wing have left me wondering if I would ever purchase another Delta product. My DJ-20 joiner has a small pit in the outfeed table. Not enough to take it back, but the quality assurance just wasn't there. I'm not sure you'd be any better off with a Grizzly. I've heard horor stories from many fellow woodworkers with various brands of tools, and I'm wondering if buying tools is getting to be a crap shoot. The folks who seem to get it right, in my opinion, these days are the Canadians. The quality of tools from Canada is to me impressive. Just my opinion.
Don
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I'm a happy 1023 owner. No horror story. Works great.
-j
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rickluce said:

I have a Delta X jointer - I was lucky, but many had problems with warped fences. My contractor saw had a table that was so warped, it left a wave on the end of a cut board. This was years ago, and the first tool I purchased - so it took me a while to figure out what was wrong. I ended up grinding the thing by hand to true it up. They do seem to have a problem with rushing green castings into production too soon. And the customer service has really deteriorated. They used to respond quickly to warranty parts replacements, but the last time I called for a warped bandsaw wheel on a brand new 14" Delta, I never got the parts. Called again, still never got the part. I bent the damned thing true myself in order to use it, and just gave up on them.
The same dealer also carries General. Their left tilt contractor saws and the 650s are good saws but I hear bad things about their support and manuals. And I'm not too certain about the availability of accessories like snap-in splitters and zero clearance inserts. Their fence is a nice Canadian made Beis clone.
I hear great things about the 1023SLX Grizzly, but really horrible stories about the delivery process. Much down time and broken/damaged parts from freight handlers. They DO seem to respond quickly with new parts, no questions asked. And the massive carriage and handwheels action on the 1023 is impressive. But I've never cut wood on one...
I bought the new Porter Cable 2 1/4 HP router kit when it first came out, and what a pile-o-crap full of Chinese parts. Shoulda gotten an old, used 690...
Manufacturing, Products and Support are failing miserably in this country. If something isn't done - like killing off some bean counters and greedy Wall Street investors, we are going to become a real third rate country. We've already lost the number one spot.
FWIW,
Greg G.
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When have you heard this? I can't recall anything but good stories about their deliveries in the past couple of years.
j
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Deliveries of wrecked equipment from Grizzly was a serious problem a few years ago.
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