OT: What are our schools learning

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You are mistaken. See below.

Partially mistaken on this part.

What? Not shoot them if they can't get such jobs? You're getting soft in your old age.

Man, you've been worked over but good. It really makes me wonder what happened to you in school. Could you possibly paint with a broader brush? Oh, sorry, I see you're using the WWII surplus Kaiser 2000 HVLP. Make sure you don't miss any spots!
You seem to think that the little tykes are nothing more than cups waiting to be filled. Sure the teachers and parents have responsibilities, but the main thing that should be instilled...should be _taught_, is the desire to learn. This can easily come from negative motivation. "My teacher/parent/insert person here is an a- hole, and I'll show them exactly how much they don't know!" It can come from positive motivation, and a even a, gasp!, non-omniscient teacher. "Well, gee, son, is that how it works?! When I started telling you about this stuff, I knew you were going to be a quick learner, but you've outdone me! Now run that by me again so I'm sure to understand it." You don't think that second kid is going to start salivating after knowledge?
Some of the best lessons come from finding out that the person that is supposed to be instructing someone doesn't know all about something. Then it's up to the student if they want to find out more. It's always up to the student, idin't? From the way you've been carrying on, I'm guessing you're carrying a bit of the good ol' American hostility towards teachers around with you for a good many years. So, where did you get to be so smart, hmmm? Did you wait around for the perfect teacher to appear, or did you just realize that it was up to you, and you went out and got the knowledge you thought you needed?
There are three ways to deal with an obstacle: - bitch about it and just stand there - wait around until someone comes along and ask them to move it out of your way - or just find your own damned way around it.
R
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Christ-a-mighty! May we assume you have surveryed all teachers in all locations in reaching this astounding conclusion?
Or are you just blowing it out your ass?
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snipped-for-privacy@indy.rr.com says...

I have met very few teachers in K-12 for whom that was not the case. Most of the ones for which it was not were WWII veterans.
Friend of mine with a PhD in education and 40 years as a teacher bemoans that situation regularly. I find it amusing that when shown a shackle he was unable to identify it.

Why is it so important to you to believe that teachers know anything about anything other than the theory of teaching. Or are you one of those poor deluded fools who thinks that because _his_ kids get good grades the schools are doing a good job for them and that it's all those _other_ schools that suck? Or perhaps you are a teacher and your ox is being gored?
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J. Clarke wrote:

J. Clarke wrote >> Any more silly questions? > > Yes. What relevance does this have for Fortran?
>>None at all, but it's fun to torment the "I program in machine code >>because it gives me more control than assembler" crowd.
**What do ya want to say to someone who thinks it's fun to torment people? Probably better to look the other direction and hope they find religion.
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Someone wrote today in rec.crafts.metalworking:
Mr. Clarke, You are confusing me. You criticize the group for not possessing the knowledge to shorten a chain and yet you obviously do not know, because you asked the question. Sounds like a very good case of self criticism for a task that is rather simple. Did you expect the group to do your measurements, determine the type and location of the attachment points and pull the correct length out of our ass? Steve
Is there a theme?
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An argument in text seems to be Mr. Clarkes' theme.
Mark
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wrote:

Which is why many of us have him filtered. He causes these same types of trollish arguments over on Wreck.Metalheads.
-- Know how to listen, and you will profit even from those who talk badly. -- Plutarch
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I've had some damn good teachers. Sorry about the idiots you've met up with -- they HAVE left their mark.
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Steve wrote:

He may be reporting on other surveys. In my state, for example, a recent survey found that 30% of high-school biology teachers believed that humans and dinosaurs were contemporaries.
I taught high school Physics and Chemistry.
We had seven math teachers in the school and I had more college mathematics than all of them. Combined. I was forever giving my physics students math problems that confounded their math teachers when the students went to them for help. Things like Zeno's Paradox or whether the universal set was a proper subset of itself.
The pity was that a retired engineer could have walked into virtually any of the math classes and and made the subject fascinating.
Here's an example: The teaching of plane geometry. Of the three teachers who, at one time or another, taught the subject, not a one knew why it was in the curriculum. The purpose behind teaching plane geometry is not to turn out surveyors or pyramid-builders; the purpose behind teaching plane geometry is to teach deductive thinking! Plane geometry is merely the vehicle to achieve a broader goal.
So the teachers taught the "subject" rather than the purpose. To bring this back to wood-working, it's like having a semester of drill on how to make jigs without any concept of the eventual use of the constructed tool.
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snipped-for-privacy@NOSPAMgmail.com says...

The really sad part is the stuff they teach that is just plain _wrong_. I didn't realize that that was happening until junior high school, when Mrs. Carpenter informed us that jet engines worked on "the principle of jet" (Newtons' laws apparently didn't have anything to do with it) and that a "coronagraph" was some kind of timepiece. It was a great revelation--before that I was under the impression that teachers were teachers because they had achieved high mastery of their subject, not because their husband's job at the mill wasn't bringing in enough to make ends meet and it was the only job they could get.
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I can see your points: It's ridiculous that somebody, in the real world, NEEDS to have a job to make ends meet, and you feel you should be the one to tell them what jobs are acceptable. You expect perfection in others, but don't offer it up yourself - I've read your posts. You believe that there are no good teachers anywhere. You are angry and bitter. Well, that's not a point of yours, but it is rather obvious.
To sum up, we have a person (you) that is imperfect, bitter, angry, lacking communication skills and social graces, that wants to tell other people what to do to make things perfect. Let me know how that works out for you...
R
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RicodJour wrote:

It's "... to tell other people what to do to make things PERFECTLY."
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Brush up or hush up. http://www.teachingideas.co.uk/english/worksheets/adjwsht.htm
R
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<<...snipped...>>
<<...snipped...>>
...perfectly make things ...make things perfectly
...make perfect things ...make things perfect
I thing any of those would be OK. What am I missing?
--
There is always an easy solution to every human problem -- neat,
plausible, and wrong." (H L Mencken)
  Click to see the full signature.
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On Oct 19, 6:22pm, snipped-for-privacy@sdf.lNoOnSePsAtMar.org (Larry W) wrote:

That Bub is a boob. His attempts at humor can charitably be described as lame. His reasoning faculties are a wee bit lower down on the scale.
I knew what I meant, and I wrote it.
R
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RicodJour wrote:

Okay then. I guess that's the last word on this thread. We can all walk away and find better things to do.... Whew, for a moment, I thought it would never come to an end. But I'm glad I was mistaken.
Bill
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wrote:

Is your "wall" thread still going? I haven't called in lately.
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Lobby Dosser wrote:

Thank you for asking. Unfortunately, the hours I needed to put into my job went up in August/September and the temperatures went down, so I had to stop playing with the drywall mud. I'm basically ready to sand and put on the final layer of mud...in the spring.
I did notice some small cracks along the edge of the ceiling following the temperature changes. My mud was thick there. The previous owner caulked over some irregularities like that. I reckon I'll need to do the same. I still need to choose my lighting.
Regards, Bill
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On Tue, 19 Oct 2010 09:01:55 -0400, J. Clarke wrote:

You mean like what I call the Parson Weems version of American History?
--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

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That's another one. And there was the Americanism vs Communism class in which we learned that the Continental legal system (they didn't call it that in class of course) was unique to Communism.
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