OT: Linux Troll

[Luigi Zanasi]

On Tue, 06 Apr 2004 19:19:48 -0400, Tom Watson scribbled:

I am in a similar situation and have made the decision to switch to Linux in the near future. I have Mandrake 9.1 installed on one computer & am trying to set up a network. I think I will make the final switch when Mandrake 10.0 comes out very soon.

My understanding is that Linux also usually has a heavy footprint, at least the current distributions. Geeks, please correct me if I'm wrong. Although you can also get distros that run off a CD

I've tried Open Office (OO) on my Windows system. I like it. No problem transferring files in Excel, but some glitches in formatting with MSWord. I also like the GNUmeric spreadsheet. Unless you're doing graphic design professionally, I understand the GIMP works as well as photoshop. I tried it. The many windows totally confused me at first, but I figured it out with the help of some other wreckers. See the thread on: "Converting bitmap line drawing to reasonable size GIF"

You've get a plethora of programs to do the email/newsgroup/web browsing thing.

I think the only problem is CAD (not an issue for me, I don't use it professionally - I just need it for woodworking and today I used it to help Marilyn figure out how many curtains she could get out of a piece of material), but you might look into using crossover office or some other emulators.

Dunno.

Yes for Word, Excel, Powerpoint. OO has no problem accessing Access databases, but the front-end stuff does not work.

You main problem will be deciding which of the too many options you like best, so you can go on other newsgroups and Slashdot and flame anyone who doesn't share your preferences.

Luigi Replace "nonet" with "yukonomics" for real email address

[patriarch]

Allen Epps wrote in news:060420041945006907% [e-mail]:

I get all tingly when I sit down at my eldest son's new dual processor Mac. Several GBs of RAM. Set up especially for video editing and graphics rendering, it seems to warp space and time.

But then, $2.5k, plus the monitor(s) ought to buy something!

No wonder big power tools look to be a bargain! And they last a lot longer, too.

Patriarch

[bridger]

one this year, dammit. I'm getting pretty good at cleaning the crap out of XP. there's a lot of stuff in there that really needs to be shitcanned before the OS runs well, IMO. Bridger

[Morris Dovey]

I'd like to mention that you can install /both/ systems on your machine. That allows you to revert to familiar tools when you're short on time and don't know how (yet) to get the job done in a Linux environment.

Dealing with network compatability issues may depend most on the proficiency and cooperation of the network administrator.

There are Linux user groups available that can help if/when you have difficulties. I tap into the CIALUG (Central Iowa Linux Users Group). A number of these guys are sysadmin types and are really helpful. There's probably a LUG in your area that might help with installation. The CIALUG hosts what they call "Installfests" to which wannabe Linux users can take their computers.

[Eugene]

Even if you install everything in a distro it still takes less space than windows/office/etc, all the distros I tried did.

I just started searching for Linux CAD and have found many to try, just haven't had a chance to try out any yet.

[Eugene]

MAC=BSD like Internet Explorer = Mosaic. Just because they start with bsd code doesn't mean it stayed that way. Apple has been known to break as many standards as MS.

[Larry]

SNIP

[Doug Winterburn]

[snip]

CAD shouldn't be a problem. There are many cad progs that run on linux. Here's one that I use - Qcad - and it runs on Mac Linux Windows, BSD,

-Doug

[Allen Epps]

[Bob]

Morris has a good suggestion above. I only wanted to point out that both Linux & Windows can have large or small footprints. It's all in what you decide to install with the OS. The default Fedora install is quite large, but it can be pared down, as Windows can be.

As for viruses, etc, Windows leads the pack, however *nix machines are most often are targets of attacks (according to zdnet, fwiw), in terms of hacking.

For any OS, be it Mac, *nix, Windows, etc, you'd be foolish to not run some antivirus program and,(especially if you have broadband), either a hardware and/or software firewall.

Knoppix, as mentioned earlier, is good as well. My suggestion would be try running Linux for a week without running Windows, if you have say a second computer. This will force you to learn how to configure display settings, network settings, program installation, etc.

Good luck!

p.s. I love your work Tom - great stuff.

Bob

[George]

Real answer? Remember the days of 4DOS and such, and open-source shareware written by every Tom's Harry to be "as good as?" Linux seems to be in about that stage right now. Anticipate the unexpected in interoperability.

I still have my GeoWorks disks somewhere. Liked it better'n 3.1, but, alas, I was one of the few.

[John McCoy]

Steve Dunbar wrote in news: [e-mail]:

Knoppix is the way to go for this situation. Get the CD, try running it for a while - then if you like the way Linux works, you can format your disk & make a permanent Linux install.

Knoppix runs directly from the CD and does not affect your Windows install at all. It's very good at detecting hardware & configuring itself correctly (at least on desktops - a laptop might be a bit of a concern since they sometimes have wierd custom hardware).

(being Linux, there are of course alternatives - there's a Mandrake

-on-a-disk now, and 4 or 5 others. I've used Knoppix, tho, and can vouch for it's ease of setup).

John

[mttt]

I use/run XP, Win2K, Solaris and Linux @ work. I use XP @ home.

I choose simply to "conform" at home. Its a battle in which I chose to surrender, at home.

C'mon Tom. Disk is cheap. GHz is cheap. Are you being pragmatic or is there some dogma involved?

Before I caved @ home - I used tools like Ghost and dual-boot to see if I could live with Linux on a home box. I decided it wasn't worth the effort.

YMMV.

[Kevin]

Hello Tom,

Setup can be a pain and doing some of the things that were second nature in Windows will require a lot of reading of the man pages. Installation of software programs can also be quite different. Earlier versions of Linux/Unix required one to mount the CD/floppy drive and when finished, to umount them. Learning the OS will be pretty much uphill for awhile (2-3 months) before you get comfortable with it. It is quite a bit better thatn Windows on memory, file, and data management. As far as what flavour to get, SUSE seems to be taking the place of RedHat which got all bloated in ego and began charging. I used Slackware for a time but the installation is something that was a horror! Every little itsy-bitsy thing it would ask you if you wanted it. And being a novice at the time how the heck would I know if I needed it. Have never tried Gentoo or Debian. All the Linux flavours are pretty much the same varying primarily in where some files are stored. Star Office is a package that pretty much does what MS Office does and from what I've seen you can save in the MS format. A-CAD 2004/5 is NOT available in anything but Windows. Virus protection is a must on all computers. Most noise./news is generated about the Windows environment as that is what most users are using. When I install software on Macs I ask that the virus protection be disabled as it will interfere at times with some programs' being installed. Ever so often I hear "I don't run any." I fear the day that some a$$hole writes a particuarly malicious virus for the Mac as many folks will be hit hard and IT support will have a lot of cleanup to do. If the new laptop is big enough, you can try installing a dual boot system. Have Linux on one patition (actually it would sit on 3 or 4) and Windows on another. That way you can have your software as well as being able to play around with Linus.

Note: My own philosophy is that regular users and I include myself, don't give squat about the OS, the more transparent the better. They just want to be able to use their software.

"Tom Watson" wrote in message news: [e-mail]...

[Larry Blanchard]

A little off the topic, but I got a chuckle today. Went in to Staples to get some CD mailers and saw a Soundblaster card on their clearance table. I didn't really need one, but picked it up and was reading the system requirements. To paraphrase:

133mhz for W95/98 200mhz for ME 300mhz for XP

Before long, it'll take a whole gigahertz just to keep Windows going :-).

The store clerk started laughing too when I told him what I was laughing at.

[Larry Blanchard]

Agreed. But if you've used any Unix/Xenix OS and do know a fair amount, Slackware is a great distribution and extremely flexible.

Someone commented that in Unix you really do need virus protection. I had said that you didn't. What I should have said is you don't need it if your only connection to the outside world is a dialup and your ISP does a good job of filtering. Both of those conditions apply to me - I should not have forgotten that they didn't apply to a lot of others. Sorry.

[Tom Watson]

It looks like I won't be making the new laptop into a Linux box.

I need to leverage what I already know and I'm already pretty well versed in Windoze. I can't really devote the needed time to learning the ways of Linux on a machine that needs to go into the bidness world fray right out of the box.

Jeff Thunder had an interesting suggestion - get a second hard drive and load some flavor of Linux on that. This would allow me to play around with the Linux stuff and get used to it - while not mucking up the business side of the machine.

The deal killer is really that I need to use Autocad and I need to pass files back and forth seamlessly with coworkers who are, without exception, using MS business apps.

A further concern is how a Linux box would interface with my company's network and the Axapta ERP.

It seems that Wintel will be the lingua franca of the business world for some time to come.

I appreciate all the help and will begin saving my pennies for a spare hard drive.

Thanks to all.

Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker (ret) Real Email is: tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet Website:

[D. Mo]

My advice is to do a search for a LUG. Linux Users Group. They are every whwere and see when one close to you is having an installfest. You show up with the computer you want to install linux on and there are usually seeveral linux gurus there. It can be a fun time an hey there is someone there who can take you step by step through the installation. They usually have several distros available there and you just may find someone there who uses linux to do exactly what you want.

I'm currentlly a member of both the GNHLUG and the NNHLUG.

D. Mo

[Larry Jaques]

On Wed, 7 Apr 2004 11:44:01 -0400, "George" brought forth from the murky depths:

I left my DesqView software in Vista when I moved a couple years ago. It was something I hadn't needed since Win 3.0. Fond memories of multitasking and dual monitors before Vinders, eh? That was back when a "huge" 20MB harddrive cost $300 and memory was only $100 a meg.

It's spring and time to pay UncleSam his due (hah), put a new drive in the old computer, and make a LAMP box out of it. I have Mandrake 9 on disc waiting to go...

------------------------------------------------- - Boldly going - * Wondrous Website Design - nowhere. - *

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[Eugene]

SNIP

Seems a lot of computer guys think the same thing. My problem is after working in IT for years its starting to creep into my home hobbies. I was telling a cow-orker earlier this week that the whole time I was replumbing my kitchen I kept thinking of ways to run dual redundant water lines with clustered valves to ensure maximum uptime of the kitchen sink :)