OT: Linux Troll

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wrote:

I have spent the last few days setting up after a bad crash. second one this year, dammit. I'm getting pretty good at cleaning the crap out of XP. there's a lot of stuff in there that really needs to be shitcanned before the OS runs well, IMO.     Bridger
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snipped-for-privacy@erehwon.com says...

A little off the topic, but I got a chuckle today. Went in to Staples to get some CD mailers and saw a Soundblaster card on their clearance table. I didn't really need one, but picked it up and was reading the system requirements. To paraphrase:
133mhz for W95/98 200mhz for ME 300mhz for XP
Before long, it'll take a whole gigahertz just to keep Windows going :-).
The store clerk started laughing too when I told him what I was laughing at.
--
Where ARE those Iraqi WMDs?

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Clients... that explains the silly remarks about macs.
Old news that macs are cheaper due to several factors, the most significant being the cost of support.
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Tom Watson wrote:

Linux has progressed in leaps and bounds in the last year or so. Desktops like KDE and Gnome have as many features as the windows desktop or more. You have openoffice and Koffice as well as other office type apps to choose from. You can open, edit and save pdf's just fine. Programs like dia and kivio are decent drawing programs, Gimp is a very nice photo type editor. I have tried out a couple CAD programs so far.
Linux gives you choice, with windoes your limited to the little differences between the 9x and NT based systems. Mac your stuck with their os and hardware. Linux you can use different distributions, you can use different hardware, you can have different desktops. Choose your flavor, your color. Windows and MAC you can have any color you want as long as its black :) i.e you have to do it their way.
Linux now is no more difficult to install that windows and there is plenty of documentation on the internet, not just the copies of the support pages from Microsoft.
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Try it. Linux is very easy to install. What is difficult is making changes afterward... What you will find is that no one will give you 100% of the answer you need and no man page will have 100% of the answer. You will spend hours researching the most simple answers, such as 'Why did my USB mouse work after installation but not after a reboot?' Linux is still a geek OS, it is for people who want their OS to be their hobby.
Download Knoppix and burn it to a CD. That should give you a good idea if you want to go further with Linux. http://www.knopper.net/knoppix/index-en.html

Linux is not faster than XP. Linux is not less bloated than XP, if anything it can be worse. Most distros install everything including the kitchen sink, but that's not necessarily bad because it gives you lots of doodads to play with.

maybe
Try Knoppix.
--
McQualude

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McQualude wrote:

On my hardware it runs a lot faster. Now I will agree/admin Redhat is not faster but they seem to have to mess with everything, other distros are much faster (I tried a couple until I decided).
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On Wed, 07 Apr 2004 02:06:42 +0000, Eugene wrote:

In addition, RedHat is going subscription enterprise only at the end of this month, but are recommending Fedora for folks who are as cheap as I am. Currently running RH9 with Ximian Desktop 2, but soon will have to decide on Fedora or Suse (Novell). Since Novell also owns Ximain, Suse may be it.
As always, the biggest hurdle in any change is "change".
-Doug
--
"A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always
depend on the support of Paul." - George Bernard Shaw
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Tom,
I've worked with Linux in development environments and found it to be a good alternative. Installation, however, can still be pretty tricky, and I think you will have trouble finding something that can work with Access.
Tom Wojeck Baltimore, MD

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Tom Watson wrote:

MS Access will probably be a problem. Codeweavers' <http://www.codeweavers.com/ Crossover Office lets you run some Windows programs, such as Word and Excel, in Linux. There is an Autocad clone called Intellicad which may be possible to run in Linux using the WINE Windows emulator. Two of the Intellicad distributors (Bricsnet and Progesoft) are currently beta-testing Linux versions. There are a number of Linux CAD programs, most of them pretty rudimentary. See Phrostie's Cad-Tastrafy site for more information on these: <http://pfrostie.freeservers.com/cad-tastrafy/ .
Linux can be tricky to set up on a laptop. There's a site called "Linux on Laptops," or something like that, with information on various models of laptops.
The suggestion to try Knoppix is a good one. Knoppix needs no installation--it runs directly from CD. It's pretty good at automatically detecting your hardware and setting itself up appropriately.
--
--
Steve

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Knoppix is the way to go for this situation. Get the CD, try running it for a while - then if you like the way Linux works, you can format your disk & make a permanent Linux install.
Knoppix runs directly from the CD and does not affect your Windows install at all. It's very good at detecting hardware & configuring itself correctly (at least on desktops - a laptop might be a bit of a concern since they sometimes have wierd custom hardware).
(being Linux, there are of course alternatives - there's a Mandrake -on-a-disk now, and 4 or 5 others. I've used Knoppix, tho, and can vouch for it's ease of setup).
John
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If you're going to make the switch to Open source, try NetBSD http://www.netbsd.org . Very small foot print, effecient, much more secure by default than Linux and much steeper learning curve. There's no fancy GUI to help you through the install--real primative, like foresaking power tools and using only hand tools. I made the leap to BSD a few years ago when many Linux distros started getting "hoggy". My home NetBSD firewall runs on a 486 with 32 megs of ram and a 512meg hard drive. I think it has about 18 months uptime by now.
Either Linux or BSD will have LOTS of free software for you to try. You'll have to figure out what you need.
On the other hand, and please don't take this as a flame, if you can't perfromance tune XP and make it run really well on a P4, you may not be the right type for Linux or BSD.
Also of interest, the new Mac OS X is based on FreeBSD. Unforunately, based on my experience with my wifes Mac G4, it is the biggest RAM hog I have ever seen. My wifes G4 boots up using 300 megs with no applications launched! Despite the ineffecencies, OS X is a decent operating system, and it's good to see Apple scrap the junk they were selling in favor of (finally) a decent operating system.
FYI and FWIW, I manage 11 technicians/engimeers and we administer about 350 servers for several differnet clients. 70% Windows NT/2K, some Novell, the rest are UNIX with a few Linux and about 20 BSD boxes. In truth, I'd rather be woodworking for a living.
My opinions. Take what you want and leave the rest.
kevin B.

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Kevin B wrote:
SNIP

Seems a lot of computer guys think the same thing. My problem is after working in IT for years its starting to creep into my home hobbies. I was telling a cow-orker earlier this week that the whole time I was replumbing my kitchen I kept thinking of ways to run dual redundant water lines with clustered valves to ensure maximum uptime of the kitchen sink :)
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Eugene wrote:

Ah...but did you put in the pretty orange isolated ground outlet for your toaster? :)
Tim
--
No BoomBoom for me! - snipped-for-privacy@BoomBoomVerizon.net


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scribbled:

I am in a similar situation and have made the decision to switch to Linux in the near future. I have Mandrake 9.1 installed on one computer & am trying to set up a network. I think I will make the final switch when Mandrake 10.0 comes out very soon.

My understanding is that Linux also usually has a heavy footprint, at least the current distributions. Geeks, please correct me if I'm wrong. Although you can also get distros that run off a CD

I've tried Open Office (OO) on my Windows system. I like it. No problem transferring files in Excel, but some glitches in formatting with MSWord. I also like the GNUmeric spreadsheet. Unless you're doing graphic design professionally, I understand the GIMP works as well as photoshop. I tried it. The many windows totally confused me at first, but I figured it out with the help of some other wreckers. See the thread on: "Converting bitmap line drawing to reasonable size GIF"
You've get a plethora of programs to do the email/newsgroup/web browsing thing.
I think the only problem is CAD (not an issue for me, I don't use it professionally - I just need it for woodworking and today I used it to help Marilyn figure out how many curtains she could get out of a piece of material), but you might look into using crossover office or some other emulators.

Dunno.
Yes for Word, Excel, Powerpoint. OO has no problem accessing Access databases, but the front-end stuff does not work.
You main problem will be deciding which of the too many options you like best, so you can go on other newsgroups and Slashdot and flame anyone who doesn't share your preferences.
Luigi Replace "nonet" with "yukonomics" for real email address www.yukonomics.ca/wooddorking/antifaq.html www.yukonomics.ca/wooddorking/humour.html
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Luigi Zanasi wrote:

Even if you install everything in a distro it still takes less space than windows/office/etc, all the distros I tried did.

I just started searching for Linux CAD and have found many to try, just haven't had a chance to try out any yet.

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On Tue, 06 Apr 2004 21:57:18 -0700, Luigi Zanasi wrote:
[snip]

CAD shouldn't be a problem. There are many cad progs that run on linux. Here's one that I use - Qcad - and it runs on Mac Linux Windows, BSD,
<http://www.ribbonsoft.com/qcad.html
-Doug
--
"A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always
depend on the support of Paul." - George Bernard Shaw
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Tom Watson wrote:
I'd like to mention that you can install /both/ systems on your machine. That allows you to revert to familiar tools when you're short on time and don't know how (yet) to get the job done in a Linux environment.
Dealing with network compatability issues may depend most on the proficiency and cooperation of the network administrator.
There are Linux user groups available that can help if/when you have difficulties. I tap into the CIALUG (Central Iowa Linux Users Group). A number of these guys are sysadmin types and are really helpful. There's probably a LUG in your area that might help with installation. The CIALUG hosts what they call "Installfests" to which wannabe Linux users can take their computers.
--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto, Iowa USA
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Hey Tom,
Morris has a good suggestion above. I only wanted to point out that both Linux & Windows can have large or small footprints. It's all in what you decide to install with the OS. The default Fedora install is quite large, but it can be pared down, as Windows can be.
As for viruses, etc, Windows leads the pack, however *nix machines are most often are targets of attacks (according to zdnet, fwiw), in terms of hacking.
For any OS, be it Mac, *nix, Windows, etc, you'd be foolish to not run some antivirus program and,(especially if you have broadband), either a hardware and/or software firewall.
Knoppix, as mentioned earlier, is good as well. My suggestion would be try running Linux for a week without running Windows, if you have say a second computer. This will force you to learn how to configure display settings, network settings, program installation, etc.
Good luck!
p.s. I love your work Tom - great stuff.
Bob
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Real answer? Remember the days of 4DOS and such, and open-source shareware written by every Tom's Harry to be "as good as?" Linux seems to be in about that stage right now. Anticipate the unexpected in interoperability.
I still have my GeoWorks disks somewhere. Liked it better'n 3.1, but, alas, I was one of the few.

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forth from the murky depths:

I left my DesqView software in Vista when I moved a couple years ago. It was something I hadn't needed since Win 3.0. Fond memories of multitasking and dual monitors before Vinders, eh? That was back when a "huge" 20MB harddrive cost $300 and memory was only $100 a meg.
It's spring and time to pay UncleSam his due (hah), put a new drive in the old computer, and make a LAMP box out of it. I have Mandrake 9 on disc waiting to go...
------------------------------------------------- - Boldly going - * Wondrous Website Design - nowhere. - * http://www.diversify.com -------------------------------------------------
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