OT: Are Woodworkers smarter than your average bear?

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On Sun, 06 Jun 2004 19:57:47 -0400, Nova wrote:

Sooooo, the older we get, the more on we get. I knew there was a reason...
-Doug
--
"A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always
depend on the support of Paul." - George Bernard Shaw
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xrongor wrote:

It seems like I'm working towards it.
-- Jack Novak Buffalo, NY - USA (Remove "SPAM" from email address to reply)
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Nova wrote:

I'll dirnk, er, drink to thaaat...
-- Mark
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Larry C in Auburn, WA wrote...

Larry, did you score 158 on the tickle "Classic IQ" test? If so, would you kindly compare your answers with mine at:
http://www.paragoncode.com/temp/1.htm
Yesterday, I "bragged" that I had correctly answered all the questions when I took this test last year, at the behest of my son. However, I scored 144, at the time, I believe. When I ran through the test again yesterday, I scored only 142 (owing to a brain cramp on question 20 -- thanks to Doug Miller for a wake-up call on that one).
The reason I thought I had gotten a perfect score, was that when I first took the test, I scored a few points higher than my son had, so he went over my results, comparing them to his. When he changed his answers (one by one) to match mine, the score increased with each change until it finally matched my score. Then he went through the test, changing the answer for each question one at a time, and noting that each time, the score dropped by two points. When he finished, he explained to me what he had done and informed me that I had correctly answered every single question!
Honestly, I was surprised; I tend to make mistakes, even when I know what I'm doing. And it appears now that I have done just that (again!) since obviously, 144 is not the highest possible score on the test!
When I realized that I had made at least one mistake yesterday afternoon, a new possibility occurred to me. I wondered if perhaps some wrong answers had a higher value than others. If this is the case, then my son Tyler's check, which I doubt was exhaustive, could have missed some answers that were better than mine. If the max score is greater than 144, it seems that this indeed must the case.
If you have the time and inclination, please let me know which of your answers differ from mine. It would put my curiosity to rest.
Thanks!
Jim
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A more interesting consideration than intelligence for wood workers would be the prevalence of bad spellers and dyslexics. Woodworking doesn't require a lot of reading, and once you understand the principles of it, it doesn't require reading lots of directions.
As for intelligence tests, I usually do very well on them (160+), but I do not believe in them. I do believe that I have a PhD to my name though, and I'm told that means something. (I argue it is like a driver's license, it means more to you if you don't have one!)
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Nathan Allen wrote...

(G) I don't think the tickle "IQ test" is anything more than an amusing diversion, though. Entertainment purposes only. I suspect the majority of others who take it feel the same way.

Possibly it's just a reflection of (primarily American) culture as a whole, with its long-diminishing emphasis on grammatical and spelling rigor.
Cheers!
Jim
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Or, more likely, low reading ability.
That's why we catch misspellings - it doesn't "look" right.

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Well, the answer is yes, we are smarter than the average bear, just! (or bearly :)
The figures: 135, 127, 142, 136, 127, 129, 131, 135, 138, 144, 133, 142, 135, 158, 133.
Average IQ of USA: 98 Starting IQ for an Astronomer: 120
Average from sample of 15 on the Wreck: 136.33
5% of population > 126 Avg Mensa ~ 146
Very roughly: Gifted > 130 (one in one hundred) Highly Gifted - 140ish to high 150s (one in one thousand) Extremely Gifted - over 160 (one in one hundred thousand) Profoundly Gifted - over 180 (one in one million)
National averages: http://www.rlynn.co.uk/pages/article_intelligence/t4.htm
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Groggy, I question these national averages. While the IQ test was designed around an expected score of 100 and a standard deviation of 10, I have read lately that the national average has climbed almost a full standard deviation, meaning that an IQ score of 130 is only two standard deviations from the mean, or roughly 95% falls under that score.
I don't believe these internet test sites are reliable. I have scored as high as 165, which I know is not true.
Joe

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"BIG JOE" wrote in message ...

At 60, I knew I've lost a step or two but didnt' think it was all that much. I actually thought I answered all but one question correctly (the one with all the colors, but then again, it may not have had anything to do with with the colors). Hmmmm ... I'd better behave from here on out as it appears I am no longer the smartass I once thought I was.
My guess, from the questions, is that this one can't be too very far off being in the ball park. My Army GCT (147) in '67, with easier questions as I recall, but longer and timed, resulted in an invitation (declined).to a Mensa chapter when I was in Germany. IIRC, the cutoff for that invite back then was a 136 GCT.
I've heard that the Army testing procedure is no longer the same ... not surprsing to hear that in this day and age..
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 5/15/04
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Swingman writes:

Everything changes. Shortly after I arrived at Parris Island, we were administered the Army GCT (why not the Navy, I have no idea). We had gotten in about 2 a.m. that morning at the receiving depot at Yemassee (sp?), spent 2-1/2 hours on racks, with mattresses we were forbidden to unroll, and at 8 a.m., we were taking the GCT. After that, things got hectic. My score was 137, and caused me a lot of trouble in boot camp---Self, you're so f++++ing smart, why don't you do things right?--being among the most pleasant questions.
Charlie Self "The test and the use of man's education is that he finds pleasure in the exercise of his mind." Jacques Barzun
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"Charlie Self" wrote in message

Don't feel bad, the Army didn't show much respect for draftee brains either ... except briefly to put the squeeze on you to apply for OCS. Then once you did, and their quota's were filled, you were an even bigger "shithead" for the duration.
Actually, and IIRC, an AGCT of 137 back then put you well into the top 2% of the population at the time. That ain't shabby for a Marine. <gd&r>
--
www.e-woodshop.net
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Swingman writes:

Some said that enlisting in the Marines was a contradiction of the score. But I got lucky and spent 4 mostly boring years. Great repartee, such as, "Self, get a f+++ing haircut," was a part of my normal week.
Charlie Self "The test and the use of man's education is that he finds pleasure in the exercise of his mind." Jacques Barzun
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being a military brat, much of my childhood was spent hearing, "Get a haircut!". I never thought I needed a haircut as I sat each time in the barber's chair. I'd tell them to take "just a little off". Sometimes they'd take me at my word, and then my dad would read me the riot act when he next saw me. sigh...it's a wonder I didn't turn in to a long-haired hippy freak after leaving home. But I did let my hair grow long enough after my 4 years in the service to nearly cover my ears, ala 70's style. :)
dave
Charlie Self wrote:

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snipped-for-privacy@aol.comnotforme (Charlie Self) wrote:

Hey, you have a great understress GCT score. Having a functioning mind under stress might be something that the Marine Corps would like to know.
Mine 136 GCT, San Diego 1975, similar drill.
Wes USMC 75-79 MOS 6657
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Isn't that about the time they should assign you to Sniper/Recon instead of handing you that 'Mattel-O-Matic' ?
'They' feed you all you want to hear, then there is that last line in the 'contract' . . ."The needs of the Service come first".
Regards, Ron Magen Backyard Boatshop {of course I still consider it a highlight of my life, and it got me the house I now own, helped with college, and that led me to my bride of 31 years}

SNIP
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Wes, Know the feeling . . . 'Airborne Electronic Navigational Aide Equipment Technician. Ditto on the soldering gun.
I scored just about perfect in all four 'Classification Categories . . . could have any choice I wanted. At the time I was thinking 'Career' and wanted 'Missile Electronics'. {in retrospect, maybe not the best choice}. Because of my bad eye {Vision - NOT color blindness}- no dice . . . got Airborne Nav-Aids instead . . . 38 weeks of Tech School in Biloxi, MS
I owned one before I enlisted. When they were giving the first day of 'instruction' they said to 'field strip the piece'. About 45 seconds later I had it in pieces. The Instructor flipped !! He said, he meant the two parts - stock and action. 'Oh, you mean this' and as I said it I put it back together. Talk about pissed . . . and there was nothing he could do. The next day was 'wet' fire. We 'sighted in'. I had a nice, tight group . . . just below the bull. I asked to bring it up 4 clicks . . . told NO. I asked to look through the spotting scope . . . again told NO. Because of that, instead of my usual '6 O'clock hold' I had to 'hold center' and bury the front sight in the black bull. Not the tight group I would have liked, but they were all in there and I qualified 'Expert'.
Almost the same thing a year later, in the Philippines with the M-16. Only this time I kept my mouth shut, and we shot at a silhouette. No 'bull', just get all 60 hits. "Not bad for a one-eyed fat man".
.
As far as the 'GI Bill'. I can still hear my dad and his buddies when I came back. While it paid me 'X' dollars a month for the 9 months a year I was in school, they thought it was the same as when they 'got out'. Tuition, books, and a 'living allowance'. Anyhow, it took the GI Bill, working summers & after school, plus a loan . . . but I got my degree. The first one in my family. {So now I'm an 'Over' - Over-educated, Over-qualified, and Over-fifty !!}
I haven't a clue as to,'now'. The last commercial I saw seemed to indicate a 'lump amount and 'matching funds to the individual's savings.
Regards & Good Luck, Ron Magen Backyard Boatshop

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Ron Magen writes:

My uncles were the same. Thought it was all covered. $125 a month (married, $100 single) for 9 months. College was cheaper then--my SUNY at Albany tuition was, IIRC, $200 a semester and Columbia was $40 a credit hour (considered very expensive, at least by me, which is why I ended up in Albany). Worked summers, worked afternoons and nights--the joys of loaded tires on trucks at midnight in August.

I think I saw one that said $25,000 was possible. Sounds great. My grandson is ready to attend UVa. I think 25K just might cover 2 years there. But maybe not, too. So-called prestige colleges are said to be running $40,000 a year and up. Yale, anyone?
Charlie Self "The test and the use of man's education is that he finds pleasure in the exercise of his mind." Jacques Barzun
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Charlie, For what it's worth, I think the Bill was {maybe still is - for whatever reason}focused on 'local' or 'land grant'schools. Sort of what 'Glassboro State Teachers College' would have been for me, an 'Atlantic City boy'. {Of course it's now Rowan University - amazing what money and an ego can do, isn't it}. Could have gone there, would have cost about 'a fishcake'. That was my 'backup plan' - if I was to stupid to get in anywhere else, all I had to do was be able to sign my name and I was 'in'.
{DON'T say 'No' . I remember all the 'big ego Seniors' when I was a Freshman. Family with a TON of money, and they were one step above a 'pump jockey' in smarts, yet going out to set the world on fire. 4 years later, when I was a Senior, guess who 'showed up' on their first 'Student Teaching Assignments' ? Just as stupid, only 4 years older and back in the same place they started. ZERO 'real life' experience - they 'traveled' 30 miles up the road.}
Remember, this is the same state that also had the prestigious schools of Princeton and Rutgers. Both maybe an hour {or so} away. Princeton? - WAY out of my league. Did get accepted to Rutgers, though - Engineering Program. Of course the money would have only lasted about 6 months . . .
I met Another ex-USAF guy while I was in school. While not a 'State' college, 'Philly Textile' {NOW - 'Pennsylvania University' - I think ??}was 'in' Pennsylvania so he was an 'in-state' student, plus he lived at home & 'commuted' about 10 miles to school. For him, no loans & everything was covered.
Odd that you should mention Yale. While in school I dated a girl who lived out on the 'Main Line'. Maybe I was her 'charity case', but you take what you can get . . . She had a younger sister who was in a 'semi-private' school. Maybe 4 years after our graduation, we had both married and all 4 of us were friends, her sister was ready for college. New Haven - YALE - major ?? - 'Women's Studies' !! {actually, Tennis}Don't think she ever graduated, never became the 'Champion' everyone anticipated {I think she started teaching Tennis in the Phila area}, but never really had to 'work' a day in her life.
Ah, the value of that 'Ivy League Education'.
Regards, Ron Magen Backyard Boatshop {who did get to eat in the Yale student cafeteria, before the Moose Head was stolen}

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Ron Magen responds:

Yeah. Good ol' Albany State as it was when I went there is now THE University At Albany.
I keep trying to find a sticker or decal that says Albany State. Formerly NY State Teachers College.
Sheest. Pretentious twaddle builds up daily.
Charlie Self "The test and the use of man's education is that he finds pleasure in the exercise of his mind." Jacques Barzun
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