5" ROS choices?

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On 2/7/2011 7:33 AM, Han wrote:

If I did not already have, besides the RO125, both the RTS and DTS400, I would definitely do likewise.
IMO, appears to be be an excellent choice, Han.
Might want to look on the FOG forum and see what's being said about them.
http://festoolownersgroup.com /
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Festool normally has a package deal program going that gets you a discount if you buy a Vac at the same time you buy a Domino, Sander, or Track Saw. There may be other deals available. I got my Vac with the Domino.
Also Festool normally has a better introductory price the first few months on top of the combination deal with the Vac. You might get an even better deal if you buy the 90 when it first comes out.
When I bought the Domino within the first months of introduction and the Vac I got a sizeable discount, IIRC > $200. YMMV.
Keep in mind that the 150, 125, and 90 indicate pad size in mm's.
The 150 is approximately 6" in diameter, the 125 is approximately 5" in diameter, the 90 will be approximately 3 1/2" in diameter.
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Would you buy from the closest store (brick and mortar) to where you live or an on-line store more dedicated to Festool?
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Han
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My thanks to all who contributed to the discussion; especially Karl and Leon. I still would like to know if the Festool *requires* a special (proprietary) sanding disc or can I use other brands of abrasives.
Max
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On 2/7/2011 9:53 AM, Max wrote:

Max ... I've seen videos of guys punching holes out of sheets of different types of hook and loop abrasives and using them on Festool sanders ... this was for special purposes where there was no comparable Festool abrasive available, so it can be done.
I don't know whether any other sander manufacturer's abrasives will fit Festool sanders because of the hole pattern (there is center hole), but they are hook and loop so I certainly don't why see someone wanting to cut out some paper dolls couldn't have had it. :)
Haven't found the Festool paper to be out of line with other high quality abrasives, particularly since you get a lot more mileage out of the paper when using the dust extraction system, and get a lot more work done with fewer sheet of abrasives.
That's about the best I can do ... check out the FOG forum, ask the question, and there is little doubt your will get much more informative answers.
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"Swingman" wrote:

<snip>
SFWIW, Klingspor has punched specials for me at competitive levels.
Since Festool and Klingspor both call the fatherland home, should be doable.
Lew
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Many thanks. I did post the question at the FOG forum and got essentially the same info as you provided. I also checked some prices and, as you say, the Festool prices aren't out of line. I'll be ordering my sander and abrasives tomorrow.
Max
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I wouldn't want to quad-fold my sandpaper disc before use, would you? HF sells inexpensive hollow punches if you can't find a piece of tubing to handle it. Everyone should aready have one, IMHO. http://tinyurl.com/4vxmep8 $6.49 for 9pc set.

$37 and change for 50 discs at Amazon. Not too bad.
-- If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their Fathers conquered...I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies... The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs. --Thomas Jefferson
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That centre hole is a crucial part in the way the dust collection works... very clever.
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The disk is special, however whether it is proprietaty or not I do not know. I found the pricing of the Festool paper to be quite reasonable and it is top quality. So far I have only used the Ruben grade papers in the 120, 150, and 180 grits.
If you use this paper and equipment with a vacuum, let me warn you that knowing when to change out worn out paper is something new to learn. In the past I relied on the dust not building as fast, there is no longer any of that to see. In the past I would look at the sand paper to see how clogged it was getting, new and worn out sand paper usually look the same now.
My first indicator that the paper is shot is the one that always worked, is it still cutting like a new sheet. Have a new piece close by, drag you finger across the new and then the old. If the old does not grab at your finger like the new it is time to replace it. You will find however that this paper tends to last longer because it usually stays clean and unclogged.
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Snip

I would absolutely buy locally if they had what I wanted. There is no advantage to buying from any other location, online or otherwise other than availability.
While some don't like the idea of Festool dictating pricing I prefer that every one charges the same price so that you know that you are not paying more than somewhere else.
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wrote:

I love buying locally--when they don't insist on retail pricing. But when they are merely an outlet, with no additional consultation or support, that makes no sense at all. Some local outlets sell but do NO warranty at all, even replacement of obvious mfgr defects. I'm sure that with the prices Festool gets, they demand more and better of their dealers than that.

I'd rather pay wholesale ANY DAY, than to be forced to pay retail (twice the price) on anything. Makita's SP6000K, the improved ;) clone of the Festool TS55, retails for $614 but Amazon has it for $360 delivered. I prefer a non-dictated price for obvious reasons. I know how to shop and I shop for value, not just price. I'll spend a little more to a known dealer and easier warranty system.
The Bosch and Makita impact drivers were definitely worth the hundreds I spent on each as I use them ruggedly, daily, year after year. For other things, I can get away with Chiwanese stuff. It all works out.
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That's what I would prefer to, Leon. I went to see a "local" hardware store that has an upper floor with all kinds of demo stuff, including lots of Festool. Salespeople at Godwin Hardware were very nice and helpful. It's almost 6 miles away, but we do have roads here in Bergen county :-)}, and they're even cleared by now. I just have to get over the stratospheric prices. I'm just a beginning amateur after all ...
(And, Larry, I agree with your statements, but one can make an argument that at times, the quest for lower prices has lowered all qulaity as well.)
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Han
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One of the problems with not supporting local business even if they don't offer more to you than the internet is that they help support your community. If they go out of business or leave your area you no longer get their tax support and typically a Doller General takes their place and that is followed by people that think Dollar General is high priced. And those people typically bring the value of the neighbor hood down. It becomes a downward spiral and not a great place to live.
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Absolutely right Leon. We had a nice local hardware store. Not as fancy as Godwin's, but within walking distance. It's gone now. First the owner was "forced" (I don't know the details) to switch to a larger store 50 or so feet away in the same strip mall, so his old store could become a Panera's. I am not sure the amount of business warranted the store, but I went there as often as I could. The owner also had cancer, and recently died, upon which the store was permanently closed, reinforcing the impression it was no longer viable.
So now I have to go 6 miles rather than 550 yards ...
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Han
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You meant thermospheric, didn't you?

Are you saying that Festools aren't what they used to be, Han? ;)
I disagree, thinking instead that mass acceptance of shitty, quality-free items has lowered the overall quality levels because the mfgrs know they can get away with it. Had people NOT bought the crap, it wouldn't now exist, or would be much diminished.
-- Education should provide the tools for a widening and deepening of life, for increased appreciation of all one sees or experiences. It should equip a person to live life well, to understand what is happening around him, for to live life well one must live life with awareness. -- Louis L'Amour
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The problem with prefinish sanding is that you have to do it again. Cabinets do not always line up perfectly and finish sanding, once mounted, makes the joint line disappear.
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"Leon" wrote:

------------------------------- Good point and it raises a question in my mind.
Since both sides of the face frame are sanded smooth, how much a problem of joint line mismatch do you think remains at final ass'y?
Lew
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It can be sigificant and especially if you are joining 4~5 cabinets along a wall run. Typically a wall is not straight or with out in or out bulges. While shims will remove most of the problems with uneven floors and walls you simply cannot depend on them to fis every thing. We tend to attach the units to each other and shimmed to the floor and walls as best as we can. Then we finish sand all the joints including those on the cabinet and the ones there the cabinets are joined.
Basically regardless of how well the face frames may be presanded, after joining a particular face frame and cabinet to another and then mount and shim the cabinets there can be some shift between the cabinets, it is normally not much but it does happen. Sanding once everything is in place makes everything appear more as a single unit.
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And as a side note, I believe that I have sanded 4 complete sets of installed kitchen cabinets that Swingman and I have built and installed. The first kitchen I used his Bosch ROS, the second I started with the Bosch and finished with my PC right angle ROS. Both of these jobs took 4-5 hours each and there was dust floating everywhere. Clean up took extra time.
About 3 years ago I started using my 5" Festool Rotex with the CT2200 Vac attached. That job took 2~3 hours with no dust. The last kitchen had the same results. No clean up on either.
IIRC the first two kitchens were a bit smaller than the last two.
3 grits of paper were used to sand each kitchen completely 3 times.

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