Outlook Express and/or Freeserve funny

Generally no, unless they fall into the small minority of users who do these things maliciously (i.e. to cause hassle for their employer etc).

The best course I find is to try and educate, and where possible suggest alternative working practices and/or software.

The classic opening an infected email must rank at the top. Other vectors like downloading programs and running without checking etc.

Many people sound like they are being black and white, but in many cases this is simply because they assume (incorrectly) that everyone is aware of these issues.

I agree, none of us are perfect. Would you feel safe in a car knowing that there was only one bolt holding on each wheel, the tyres were bald, and there is a detonate in the fuel tank waiting to go off should you corner too quickly or run into something? Many folks will do the IT equivalent without even realising.

Sorry, I did not make that clear...

I was suggesting that you need third party programs for protection (e.g. a good selection would be a virus scanner (AVG), AdAware, Spywareblaster, SpybotSD1.3, (possibly ZoneAlarm depending on platform)) to keep safe.

(All of these are available for personal use free. Given that and care you can be safe with IE/OE. I would also recommend you use them with _any_ web/email software).

If you don't have at least AdAware I would very strongly suggest downloading a copy and running it.

formatting link
"will get problems with other programs" comment was saying that even if you ditch OE, and only use IE when forced to, it does not guarantee you safety. There are still some classes of attack that will work in browsers like Mozilla or Firefox (Phishing scams for example).

Odd that, I had you pictured as Silver Haired ;-)

Translations, ActiveX:

IE has the ability to download and execute code contained in an ActiveX control. This is just library of executable functions lumped into a wrapper that makes it easy to integrate these functions into a web browser environment. It allows a web server to pass programs to be run on your computer to you to (in theory) enhance the functionality of a web page.

A good example would be when you visit the Microsoft Windows Update site, it downloads an ActiveX that then compares the versions of software on your computer with the latest versions and passes this information back to the web server so it can produce the list of patches you need.

This is not unlike Java which is a cross platform technology (i.e. runs on many different computers and OSes, not just windows and Intel/AMD x86) that allows similar things. However there is a critical difference. Java programs run in a virtual machine (i.e. what they sometimes call a "sandbox"). While not fool proof, it does limit the amount of control that Java programs can have over the computer running the virtual machine.

ActiveX however has none of this sophistication, once the code is on the computer it runs with the same scope, privilege and capabilities as any other program you care to run or any action you may care to take. IE has grown a huge layer of complexity with different "Zones" to control when and where ActiveX controls can do their stuff. Needless to say many of the exploits on IE rely on circumventing these Zones to trick it into downloading a control and running it without asking, because it appears to be "trusted" or from a trusted zone.

A browser like Firefox will not run ActiveX controls. This is why web pages that depend on them will not work correctly on Firefox, and you still require IE.

Browser Helper Objects:

These are libraries of executable code that can be patched into IE to extend its functionality. For example if you view a PDF document in IE, Adobe Acrobat Reader will open up inside your browser as an extension of it. This is a BHO in action. There are similar facilities in most browsers, but IE seems to acquire the things without informed intervention of the user in many cases. (Many enhanced search bars for IE fall into this category). There is not direct functionality built into IE that lets to view and control these things however. You will need to get a copy of "HijackThis", or poke about in the registry to find out what you have hooking your browser.

For some this will be true. It is a classic case of "know your enemy". For 99% of the time however we are dealing with "mass market" compromises here. Unless I know there is some information of real value to me on your computer it is not worth me spending any more time or effort on compromising it than I would on any other. Most hacks of this type are robotic. Software will scan blocks of IP addresses looking for vulnerable unpatched systems, emails will be sent out, and malicious web sites created to ensnare computers in large numbers. If these techniques do not get yours, then that is not a problem since there are millions of others to get instead.

If however you enemy has targeted you personally, and they have the resources, then they will gain entry... probably by non technical methods.

Do you include yourself in that "we" ?

Reply to
John Rumm
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Not even "Google Groups" ?

Reply to
Mike

Hurrah!

You've said it :-)

Ah but you were suggesting that the problem was the other drivers - er - other pc users who were causing problems.

Got 'em all. And run 'em.

Oh I've had those, threy don't bother me because I ifnore them. Mostly they're ditched without even opening, they're pretty obvious.

I'm sure you're right ...

I thought I'd said grey-haired ...

Lovely ...

Yes.

Yes. In the Real World you can't escape it. That's my point.

Mary

Reply to
Mary Fisher

Which sort of makes the point very well.

I read news using a text mode newsreader on a Linux box. This eliminates the need for just about *all* of that extra software you are running and maintaining. In my opinion my newsreader is also a much better newsreader than OE but that isn't really the point. I do much less work to keep safe.

(N.B. the Linux system is behind a well maintained firewall)

Reply to
usenet

It must be lovely to be perfect.

Reply to
Mary Fisher

No not perfect, just lazy! :-)

I wasn't trying to show how clever I am, rather that there are much

*easier* ways than using OE. It also has other benefits which are probably more relevent to my situation than being of general use so I haven't listed them as they didn't seem relevant to the present discussion.
Reply to
usenet

Well I'm no genius but I find OE straighforward, I can't understand why anyone should have difficulty with it ...

Mary

Reply to
Mary Fisher

Blimey, that takes me back.. thats all we had to use on Usenet 13 years ago. A text based reader running on Unix ... Those were the days

Reply to
Old Bill

... but you listed a whjole lot of other software that you need to install and run in order to be safe from the vulnerabilities that you have as a consequence of using OE. I was just saying that if you do a bit of lateral thinking there are other ways which, overall, are in fact rather easier.

Reply to
usenet

... and you think the 'modern' approach is better?

What advantages does a GUI application give you when reading newsgroups?

My newsreader is just as 'advanced' as any GUI one (more than most), it has all the bells and whistles that one could ever want. It's still being actively developed so keeps abreast of changes.

Its major advantage for me is that I run it on a remote Linux box that I can connect to from wherever I happen to be. Thus I can use the same news program and configuration from home, work, friends' houses or whatever. I don't lose track of threads etc. wherever I am.

In addition I can use the same editor as I use for everything else I do and thus don't have to use an unfamiliar (and/or rather feeble) editor to compose messages.

Finally if/when I want I can use a mouse to select threads and messages, although it's a text mode newsreader it is mouse aware.

Reply to
usenet

I didn't. Somebody else did that.

It's easier to stick with what I have. I'm not of the "If it ain't broke break it" school.

Mary

Reply to
Mary Fisher

But OE IS broke, Mary, always has been and always will be.

Microsnot: Deigned to sell, but not to work.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

... but you then said something like "Yes, I do all that", so you *do* have to make that effort.

OK, I've no problem with that, it's where I am too, I just started reading newsgroups before IE (or Windows for that matter) was invented.

Reply to
usenet

And the problem is that the innocents who *do* have compromised machines cause major problems for others, not just themselves.

rn ??

Reply to
Bob Eager

No, I use tin, it's one of the few text mode newsreaders still actively developed, the only other as far as I know is slrn.

Reply to
usenet

I meant when you started...I've forgotten what I used back in 1982 or thereabouts.

Reply to
Bob Eager

I sort of pottered around rn, trn and tin, tin has been around for a

*long* time. This would have been around 1987 as I worked abroad from 1980 to 1987 and 'discovered the internet' when I started working as a contractor at BT in 1987.
Reply to
usenet

RN it was, and rubbish it was too.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

I still use it when I have to post articles (to a private news server) over a Telnet link...because I still remember how to use it.

The one I use on my PC is much nicer!

Reply to
Bob Eager

LOL and i`m having to make a house-call tomorrow to someone who didn`t take my advice several months ago when I handed him a CD of anti-spyware apps - he`s now out of his depth and up the creek !

(which reminds me... download sysclean from Trend and put on CD ready...)

Reply to
Colin Wilson

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