tile

[JOH]

I'm going to be flooring the kitchen in a few months, using foot-square ceramic tiles. The subfloor is plywood. I have two questions.

Although the subfloor is plywood, right now there is a layer of vinyl all over the kitchen, area-glued. This stuff was all over the house. For example, it was in the main bath, and took hours to scrape it out. In one hallway, I peeled up the vinyl and just left the paper backing (since I was going to lay wood over it anyway). I mean this stuff is a pain to get up, and I don't relish the idea of scraping it up from the kitchen, with something like 400 square feet to do. Can I leave that vinyl, or at least the paper backing, glued to the subfloor?

I once saw a method for laying tile that involved putting down a layer of thinset, then a layer of these foam squares that had a waffle texture, then another layer of thinset, then the tiles. The purpose was to provide more give for the tiles, so that there would be no cracks over time. Does this method work? Anyone know where to get the waffle foam?

Thanks for your help.

[BiloxiBoy]

I would put 1/4 inch backer board (HardiBacker) down over the existing floor and then lay your tiles on top of that. Just nail it down with plenty of 11/4 roofing nails and you're good to go. They come in 3' X

5' sheets and run about $10 each. If you don't use a solid backer, (other than your plywood subfloor) your tiles WILL crack and your grout lines WILL separate.

[Ken]

Definitely need a solid stiff backing. As BiloxiBoy said, otherwise the tile and grout (assuming you use a cement based grout) will crack. When I re-did my bath a few years ago, I pulled up the old subfloor, Put solid blocking under where all the new plywood joints would go, put down new 5/8" plywood, and 1/2" backerboard. I would also recommend screwing down both the plywood and the backerboard as I did. Haven't had a single cracked tile or joint, plus the floor just feels very solid.

[SQLit]

Everyone that I know that has installed tile over vinyl has regretted it.

You could install some 1/4 backer board and then lay the tile, CAUTION this might cause problems with door thresholds. (mentioned by others)

Tile on plywood is fine as long as the underlayment is SOLID. If the underlayment flexes at all,,, well it will be come problematic

[RicodJour]

Maybe. Depends on what you do over it.

The stuff works. Don't think it's a great idea to put it over the paper.

Backerboard, as others have recommended, is the easiest sure bet.

R

[dadiOH]

It's "give" that makes tiles/grout crack.

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[JOH]

Thanks for the input!

[PipeDown]

Actually BEKOTEK

a better choice if you are not also tackling moisture problems

Its hard to buy because hardly anyone stocks it. You may need to special order from a tile store that otherwise sells Schulter stuff. Call the # on the website and ask for local retailers. I had to do that to get the metal corner bead they make.

Backerbaord would be cheaper and easier but may not compensate for deflection as well as the engineered product.

Did you try a heat gun when you scraped up the vinyl. Could make a huge difference depending on the adhesive used. A tool like this

will also lighten the load.

[goofy]

Hi, I did read of a waffle foam for tile application, in a FIne Woodworking magazine. I can't remember the issue. I am also going to use this when I lay tile during my remodel. It greatly alleviates cracking of tiles, which is why this foam was created. Good luck. Ciao. :)