On 12/4/2013 7:34 PM, email@example.com wrote:
Sure they do, but we're talking about a home user replacing bulbs he can
get a home depot at competitive prices. You tend to take a fringe view
and beat people over the head with it.
Based on watching this group for a while, I'd have to say that a lot of
what you say is technically correct, but irrelevant and even harmful in the
context being discussed.
The clueless asking questions don't have the knowledge or experience to
interpret what you say. If they did, they wouldn't have asked the question
in the first place.
In a practical home situation with lamps you bought from Ikea, the risk
of burning your house down is greater with halogens. "Utter nonsense"
gives the WRONG IMPRESSION.
Some of us think in the context of the original posting.
Halogen sockets often are much hotter, prone to failure. Wire insulation
hardens, breaks off, and the wire often breaks at crimps. Screw types are
usually smaller footprint causing more heat at the socket. The little push
in sockets also loose contact tension from heat. I've fixed Or replaced so
many equipment types over the years.
I have kitchen pot lights. I use the smaller halogen screw lamps with the
smaller footprint. They work great with dimmer, and I rarely use at full
intensity. Probably only 40 watts each.
I don't have any specific information.
If you are going to use them, make sure they are
installed in a heat resistant socket (porcelain?).
Make sure they have room to breath to wick the heat
away. Make sure the wiring is new so the insulation
won't degrade from the heat. I personally wouldn't
They sure do look pretty.
Try a Satco 5000K bulb. Should get rid of the flicker
that hurts your eyes and match the color intensity
of the halogen. Couldn't hurt to try one. A lot
safer too. And, unlike the rest of those lying
bulbs, the Satcos are actually long lived.
the riddle wrapped in an enigma wrapped
On Thursday, December 5, 2013 3:06:47 PM UTC-5, Todd wrote:
So, then you're just spewing opinion devoid of fact.
You claim to be an electrical engineer? Then you should
know that a watt is a watt. And whether it's a halogen
or regular incandescent, 95% or so of the energy is
converted to heat. Meaning that halogens are going to
generate about the same amount of heat as a regular
incandescent. Now depending on the form factor, a halogen
bulb could have a hotter surface temp. But if for
example you replace the same form factor and wattage
light bulb with a halogen, I don't see where all the added and
allegedly dangerous heat is coming from.
More FUD. Millions of people are using them. I have a variety
of them here in my house. And if they
were starting fires, you would think we's all have heard
many reports of them starting fires, they would be banned, etc.
On 12/05/2013 12:27 PM, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
Do you drive with your arm outstretch and your middle
Here you go:
From the above search:
Halogen lights are popular as they are very effective,
but their greatest disadvantage is that they emit an
extraordinary amount of heat. A standard 75-watt light
bulb operates at about 260 degrees Fahrenheit, while a
300-watt halogen light bulb can reach temperatures of
up to 970 degrees Fahrenheit.
And another from the above search:
TUNGSTEN HALOGEN AND INCANDESCENT LAMPS
DANGER! Halogen lamps operate at extremely high temperatures
that can cause serious physical injuries and property damage.
Only use Halogen lamps in Halogen-approved fixtures. Fixtures
should fully contain any parts of the Halogen lamp upon the
event of a lamp burst.
Do not use Halogen lamps in close proximity of paper, cloth
or other combustible materials that can cause a fire hazard.
Lamps are very fragile. Do not drop, crush, bend or shake
them. Vibration or impact will cause filament breakage
and short lamp life.
Do not touch the Halogen bulb surface or inside reflectors
with your bare hands. Oils from skin can lead to breakage
or shorten the life of the lamp. Use clean gloves or
lint-free cloth for installation and removal.
Clean any dirt, oil, or lint away from the lamp with alcohol
and a lint-free cloth or tissue. Any foreign particles or
materials on the bulb surface can cause hot spots on the
bulb and result in lamp failure.
Never touch the lamp when it is on, or soon after it has
been turned off, as it is hot and may cause serious
Do not look directly at the operating lamp for any period of
time; this may cause serious eye injury.
Always turn off the electrical power before inserting,
removing, or cleaning the lamp.
Affix the lamp securely in the socket. Improper installations
will cause electrical arcing, overheating and short life to
lamp and socket. Replace lamp holders and sockets when
Keep the temperature of the Halogen lamp seal below 350° C.
Keep the temperature of the Halogen bulb wall above 250° C.
Keep the temperature of the Halogen lamp bulb wall below 800° C.
Make sure lamps of specified wattage and voltage are only used
in appropriately rated fixtures. Unspecified use will lead to
short lamp life, breakage and overheating of fixture.
Lamps should not be operated beyond the total rated voltage.
Avoid the use of dimmers that may drive your lamp over its
Operate the lamp only in the indicated burn position. Failure
to do so will lead to overheating and shortened lamp life.
Use an external fuse when required.
Do not allow one lamp to directly expose another. This may
lead to overheating and shortened lamp life.
I will give you a hint. A watt is indeed a watt. How that watt
gets out is a whole 'nother interesting story. A single
glowing wire suspended in a vacuum shucks energy in a different
manner than a super heated gas inside a double bulb. The
glowing wire would tend to shuck it more by radiation and
less by convection. A super heated gas, due to the containment
it is confined to, would tend to shuck far more by convection.
That is why you need the porcelain fixture and why I do not
have them in my house. Paper light on fire at 260C and Halogen
gases can rise to 2,500°C and the bulb up to 500°C. Source:
And another hint: incandescent lamp wire glow "yellow" (about
2300 Kelvin), where super heated halogen gases glow "white"
(about 5000 to 6500 Kelvin). The difference in the kelvin
rating is why Halogen lamps look so pretty. And why they
run a hell of a lot hotter.
Now put your middle finger away and act like a gentleman.
the riddle wrapped in an enigma wrapped
The only sources I see on that search are talking about torchere
type halogen floor lamps. They are not talking about replacing
50W flood, or the typical incandescent with an equivalent wattage
and design halogen bulb, which is what the thread is about.
The form factors of those are very different than the small, narrow
tube type bulb used in torchere lamps. If you let a drape
dangel into a torchere, it can touch the small glass tube bulb.
Replace a typical 100W incandescent bulb and there is no way
that is possible. The halogen component is inside an outter
And what credibility exactly does some randome website have?
I didn't even see anything that says who's behind it. But if you
read what they say, most of it is common sense, like let the bulb
cool off before you remove it. They also don't seem to understand
the difference between heat and temperature.
Looks like typical manufacturers warnings that you find on
many products. Doesn't say they are burning houses down
when you replace your 50W incandescent flood with a 50W
Wow, who would have thought that?
Good that you now recogize the difference between heat and
The halogen replacements we're talking about are sealed
inside a glass envelope.
Show us a cite that says you need a porecelain fixture to
replace a typical 100 W incandescent with a halogen equivalent.
Paper light on fire at 260C and Halogen
If you're gonna look at the temp of the gas, then what's
the temp of a tungsten filament if you touch that, or let
it touch your drapes? More fud.
Again confusing the temp of an internal component that you
can't touch with the heat emitted from the bulb enclosure.
Sorry if you can't handle the truth. Where are all those fire
reports from 50W halogens like the OP is talking about using
because they were not put in porcelain sockets? If they are half
as unsafe as you claim, why are they still being sold. So far,
in all the above, the only thing that makes sense is the NY Times
talking about fire hazard of torch style halogens. That does make
sense because they use a very different halogen bulb from what
you have in an incandescent replacement style. Further the bulb
is in an upward facing dish, making it easy for a curtain, etc
to get in it, if you're careless enough to let that happen. I've
had several of those operating for 35 years here and no fires.
On 12/6/2013 5:34 PM, email@example.com wrote:
Damn would you take your meds.
You go off occasionaly then you go back to normal...
Obviously something is bothering you..
So take care of it, or just shut up. Not everyone has your point of
view, and if they don't you just blast them.
HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here.
All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.