OT Taxes My Proposed Taxes Fairness Bill of 2012

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On Apr 17, 3:20pm, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

There is no guarantee that a national sales tax would not have similar loopholes. I highly doubt you'd get one passed without the usual special interests getting their particular segment exempt. Housing would be one good example and with good argument. If you buy a house and decide to move in 3 years, take a new job, do you keep paying sales tax? Does it apply to used goods or just new?
And while I agree a national sales tax would be harder to avoid, it can still be done. The very rich can buy stuff overseas, for example. But that new Gulfstream in the Bahamas and base it there.

Yes, but most aren't going to spend anywhere near enough to make up for the lost income tax revenue. Hence more of the tax burder will fall on the middle class and a lot of it will fall on those that pay no taxes at all right now.
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote in

money. They can earn it and spend it without paying a dime in taxes.

Which brings us around to the other big advantage of a sales tax: It's the only way there is of taxing illegally earned income.
Sure, there might be one or two drug dealers somewhere in the U.S. who actually declare their income on Form 1040 and pay taxes on it -- but common sense tells you that most of them don't. As is the case, I'm sure, with a great many people who are paid in cash.
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On Wed, 18 Apr 2012 00:36:08 +0000 (UTC), Doug Miller

Not just illegally earned but the entire "underground economy" gets taxed.

The bigwigs do, that's what the term "laundering money" is all about.
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Sure you can.... ever heard of drug dealers? So, what corner junky is going to collect and remit sales tax?
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .

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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

Oh yes you can!
Remember when Clinton imposed a "luxury" tax on, for example, boats that cost more than $100,000?
There were two results of this action:
1. Yacht builders in the United States went out of business, laying off thousands in the industry (craftsmen, designers, salesmen, etc.)
2. The rich started buying their yachts in the Bahamas.
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At least that's what you been told to believe
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With a flat tax, I suspect there will be more economic activity. And the rich folks will do more spending. So, the increased number of transactions will make up for the lack of percentage points.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
Ummmm, yes.
This is basic tax theory, I shouldn't have to explain it.
Current income taxes are on a graduated scale. The more you make, the more you pay as a percentage.
With a sales tax that percentage difference goes away. Everyone pays the same rate. Big benefit number 1 to the rich.
Add to that, the poor are likely to spend 100% of their income. The rich are likely to save a good percentage of their income, thereby deferring any sales tax paid.
--
Dan Espen




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You suspect?
Don't you really mean you pulled that out of your nether orifice?
And I guess you completely missed the current graduated tax part.
--
Dan Espen

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I guess you missed the part where the current graduated system has so many loopholes that the rich folks aren't paying those high rates anyway. You know, everything from tax free municipal bonds, to capital gains. Haven't you heard Obama whining? A flat tax, with just one or two rates would fix that. But of course, Obama isn't interested in that, is he? No. He wants to add to the complexity of the existing mess.
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One of the problems wtih the current tax code. By giving loopholes and exemptions to certain behaviours, the tax people can reward and punish what behaviours they want. Changing behaviour, isn't the Constitutional reason for the tax system. The reason is to fund the (minimal) needs of the government.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
I guess you missed the part where the current graduated system has so many loopholes that the rich folks aren't paying those high rates anyway. You know, everything from tax free municipal bonds, to capital gains. Haven't you heard Obama whining? A flat tax, with just one or two rates would fix that. But of course, Obama isn't interested in that, is he? No. He wants to add to the complexity of the existing mess.
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And when those loopholes were created, they did encourage the desired behavior. All perfectly legitimate under "encouraging the common welfare".
This "constitutional issue" is a figment of your imagination.
But when it comes to repealing one of these loop holes when it's no longer needed we run up against ideologues that have signed the Grover Norquist pledge. So now we have irrevocable welfare for oil companies and banks.
--
Dan Espen

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Reading your last several posts, you appear to be a dyed in the wool liberal socialist.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
So now we have irrevocable welfare for oil companies and banks.
--
Dan Espen



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As long as you can fall back on what amounts to name calling, you don't even need to put together logical sentences.
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I'm asking, gently, your political leaning. If the name is not accurate, please tell me how you describe yourself.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
writes:

As long as you can fall back on what amounts to name calling, you don't even need to put together logical sentences.
--
Dan Espen



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No you started with 3 labels that most people consider pejoratives.
dyed in the wool liberal socialist
I'd vote for Chris Christi for governor. I like the job he's doing but I normally vote Democrat. I'm neither dyed in the wool, liberal nor socialist.
As you should know, the Democratic Party has been capitalist for a long time.
--
Dan Espen

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Sorry, but the Democratic party today IS liberal and is becoming more liberal each year. The days of democrats like JFK, Truman, and Patrick Moynihan are long gone.

You sure wouldn't know that from listening to the likes of Obama, Pelosi, Reid and a long, long list of them.
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Trader, do you think those are insulting terms? Dyed in the wool, liberal, socialist? I think they are descriptors, not insults.
I view the Democrat party as promoting more government spending, control, and a lot less freedom. I'd even go so far as to say socialist. The recent take over of the banks and auto manufacturers, that's socialist. When government owns the means of production.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
writes:

Sorry, but the Democratic party today IS liberal and is becoming more liberal each year. The days of democrats like JFK, Truman, and Patrick Moynihan are long gone.

You sure wouldn't know that from listening to the likes of Obama, Pelosi, Reid and a long, long list of them.
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Congress at the urgent request of President George W. Bush passed the Troubled Asset Relief Program or "TARP", funded at $700 billion.
Government HAS NOT taken over _any_ banks or automobile companies. You're in some kind of deluded dream world.
--
Dan Espen

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wrote:

Of course they have. They gave them money and the government has in the past, and is currently, telling many of these companies what they can and cannot pay in dividends, executive bonuses and other areas.
--
People thought cybersex was a safe alternative,
until patients started presenting with sexually
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I don't have the inclination to look any of this up, but what you are describing is STANDARD for any large scale investor.
That does not constitute "taking over".
--
Dan Espen

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