Kenmore Elite Dishwasher Question?

I have installed a Kenmore Elite large capacity dishwasher which has been in service four years now. About six months ago the glasses and cups on the top rack come out with debris lodged and hardened on the inside bottom.
To address this we started rinsing off all the dishes and items placed in the washer even though for the first 3 1/2 years we did not. The glasses and cups still accumulated debris.
As we have a 5 year service contract with Sears we called for repair and the service man came out and changed some parts stating all would be OK. Well, it wasn't any better.
We then called again and another visit and still no change.
And finally a third time and yet a different serviceman later and still the same problem.
To test this situation we placed clean dishes in the bottome rack and clean and dried mugs and glasses in the top rack and ran through a full 95 minute cycle.
As was expected, examination of the cups and glasses showed that about half of them now had debris hardened on the inside bottom of them. Certainly in a condition that could NOT be used in good concience.
Therefore, before I contact Sears service again and get cranky, I was hoping someone here reading this will have some sort of idea of what might be causing this situation and what, if anything, can be done about it.
Thanks all.
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Are you using powder to liquid soap. If liquid, switch to powder and report back.

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On 1/6/2005 11:02 PM US(ET), Art took fingers to keys, and typed the following:

--
Bill

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Consumer Reports always give the liquid dishwashing soaps lousy ratings and I know people who thought their dishwasher was broken until they switched back to powder soap.
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couple or three months. If you buy too big a box, the soap may have gone bad before being all used up. Tom.
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dishwashers for several decades using powder detergent and never seen it go bad unless the box got wet from a leak. THen I trash it.
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Tom wrote:

Sounds like something a sales person would make up to get a customer to buy a new box. Soap doesn't go bad. It certainly won't work properly if you get it wet and it forms hard clumps. Keep it dry and it will last as long as you need.
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On 1/7/2005 9:52 AM US(ET), Art took fingers to keys, and typed the following:

Last year, I had to have the waste line dug up due to caked dry dishwasher detergent almost completely blocking the pipe. I saw it, and poked at it with a screwdriver. It was almost the consistancy of a granular dry plaster. The septic service said to use the liquid detergent rather than the dry stuff. Perhaps it doesn't clog sewer lines as readily, but if the dry detergent does not completely dissolve, can not undissolved particles be baked on glasses and dishes, etc.during the dry cycle?
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Are you sure it wasn't clothes washer detergent? Many people have found problems with that powder getting stuck in their pipes.

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On 1/7/2005 11:24 AM US(ET), Art took fingers to keys, and typed the following:

Never used dry powder for the clothes washer, only in the dishwasher. Wifey won't use any clothes washer detergent other than liquid Tide, but she always insisted on powdered dishwasher detergent, despite my suggestions that she use the liquid type. It took the septic service guy (and the few hundred $$$) to change her mind.

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Maybe she was using too much powder detergent in the dishwasher. The new dishwashers hold less soap then the old ones and even so I fill it only half full and the dishes are always clean. In fact I use almost halve the recommended tide amount in my laundry also. Depends on water hardness.

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On 1/8/2005 5:59 PM US(ET), Art took fingers to keys, and typed the following:

Too much, it won't latch. The open tray, next to the latched part, takes about a teaspoon of detergent. We don't fill either of these trays. Nevertheless, whatever amount of dry powder is put in there, it seems a lot of it leaves the dishwasher while the granules are still intact. This was Cascade detergent, and not some cheap store brand. We have a water softener and all of our water is softened. Found this little tidbit at http://www.epinions.com/content_3003949188 "Be especially careful if you have a septic system. Powder detergents and some liquid detergents seem to crystallize in your pipes and septic system. Try to use less detergent, up to half the recommended quantity and a longer cycle works best in my experience."
Note "Powder detergents and *some* liquid detergents..."

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I still vote too much detergent. Newer dishwashers don't even have the open area now for soap. Just a smaller closed door holder and even without a water softener, less than half full is enuf. With a water softener, only a tiny amount would do it.

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On Thu, 06 Jan 2005 23:01:46 -0500, Bob_M

I had a GE that would leave little black specks of stuff on the dishes. The repairman said it was caused by deterioration of the rubber hoses in the unit. The little black specs were little pieces of rubber. He replaced the hoses and that fixed it for the most part. I think it would still leave a speck once in a while, probably from pieces stuck to the insides of the rest of the parts coming off. -- Elbridge Gerry, of Massachusetts:
"What, sir, is the use of militia? It is to prevent the establishment of a standing army, the bane of liberty. . . Whenever Government means to invade the rights and liberties of the people, they always attempt to destroy the militia, in order to raise a standing army upon its ruins." -- Debate, U.S. House of Representatives, August 17, 1789
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Bob_M wrote:

Hi,
Kenmore is made by several different companies, model#? ( Elite isn't it ).

Something that may help.... http://www.applianceaid.com/drain_wash.html#sand http://www.applianceaid.com/drain_wash.html http://www.adstation.com/maytag/dishwshr.htm#1s%20Food%20Specks jeff. Appliance Repair Aid http://www.applianceaid.com /
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Now there is one made by Bosch in the lineup. Tom
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Tom wrote:

How about the new Kenmore (the ones with the new colors)? Here they are... http://tinyurl.com/3walf
Thoughts?
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If you have the Master Protection Agreement, rather than the old Maintenance Agreement, the fourth service call in a 12 month period, triggers replacement of the dishwasher if asked for. With the old Maintenance Agreement, they can keep trying to repair until they realize the futility of their efforts and then will replace the unit.
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Thanks for all the timely recommendations. My unit is made by Whirlpool (so said the repairman).
I have been using GEL liquid for quite some time but I will immediately try powdered and see how it goes. Then, next will be the forth call. I'll let you all know.
Thanks
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