Fuel comparison charts

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On 7/1/2013 10:19 AM, Ed Huntress wrote:

Like many things that our economy rides on - necessary evil...
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It was exposed that MTBE was made in Canada and a certain small investor group - turned out to be advisory panel that voted for MTBE.
MTBE has been banned as soon as anything else was useful in the place.
California dumped it. Other states took longer but understood and got rid it it also.
Martin
On 7/1/2013 1:34 PM, Richard wrote:

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Ed Huntress wrote:

As far as I know it was banned in a many states. That is when the EPA and oil cos gave up promoting it and switched to ethanol.

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otherwords, it doesn't break down as quickly so it can be less nasty but for a longer period of time.
From the EPA website. Because MTBE dissolves easily in water and does not "cling" to soil very well, it migrates faster and farther in the ground than other gasoline components, thus making it more likely to contaminate public water systems and private drinking water wells. MTBE does not degrade (breakdown) easily and is difficult and costly to remove from ground water. How long will MTBE remain in water? MTBE is generally more resistant to natural biodegradation than other gasoline components. Some monitoring wells have shown little overall reduction in MTBE concentration over several years which suggests that MTBE is relatively persistent in ground water. In contrast, studies of surface water (lakes and reservoirs have shown that MTBE volatilizes (evaporates) relatively quickly.
--
America is at that awkward stage. It's too late
to work within the system, but too early to shoot
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wrote:

Aha. Very interesting. Thanks, Kurt.
--
Ed Huntress

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wrote:

Unlike the petroleum distillates it is in solution with, MTBE is easily removed by, to name but one, common activated charcoal filtration systems. The scare tactic was nothing more than a smoke screen generated by the petroleum refiners and distributors in a cynical attempt to misdirect the populace (by blaming a government mandated additive) and conceal the actual problem, leaking fuel storage tanks.
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address?
Right. Oh fuck yes.
Gunner
--
""Almost all liberal behavioral tropes track the impotent rage of small
children. Thus, for example, there is also the popular tactic of
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You shouldn't believe ANYONE based on their name or email address, you mouth-breathing knuckle-dragging moron.
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We obviously pay a lot of attention to your nym....(not)...
Laugh laugh laugh!!
Begone troll!!
<plink> Gunner
--
""Almost all liberal behavioral tropes track the impotent rage of small
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Wonder about Tahoe. It went deep into the cold and just created a big bubble.
Maybe in shallow lakes that get mixed up all of the time by the wind and boats - it might release itself, but I seem to recall it was heaver than water. So agitation is required.
Martin
On 7/1/2013 4:27 PM, Kurt Ullman wrote:

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Leases don't mean drilling. Billions of dollars were spent on the large state size leases offshore of California. Then after paying the government for the leases, the loonies pleaded and got a drilling halt and forbade wells out in the water.
Large tracks are held at bay in the gulf. Some were active but shut down after the spill. The area near Miami was rich in oil, but it was held back because of ugly rigs in the skyline. Then Cuba / China moved in and their rig can be seen from Miami.
MTBE dropped miles / gallon. It polluted ground water. And there is a huge bubble of it at the bottom of Lake Tahoe.
Ethanol is hygroscopic and when a tank is a breather and not sealed, it pulls in cool damp air at night, and condenses into the tank. This is a common failure mode of gas now. Special ethanol additives have been developed to trap the water and allow it to be burned. Typically it sits and freezes - cracking small motor parts. I try to run all of them wide open to use up the gas before letting them sit.
And taxes are more than Federal. Tax on the whole product string. And having the Gasoline and Crude oil different commodity and have been the souce of the 'excessive gain tax' - where the oil companies buy crude and sell the results of their work at a much higher value due to the demand price on gas and anti-demand on Crude.
So taxes are from many levels and many methods.
And I live in cattle, gas/oil/timber/farming area of Texas - and the large feed mills have had prices rise (brother worked at a large mill) and the chicken / turkey feed is up as well as dairy cattle feed / horse and pig feed. Any product that used grain - higher gas / fuel cost - rises the cost of feed. Supply and demand is another. Taking feed corn to be turned into this poor example of fuel is shameful. It was easy.
Brazil has special engines. They did it correctly. Indy cars did it also.
Martin
On 7/1/2013 7:23 AM, Ed Huntress wrote:

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On Mon, 01 Jul 2013 22:25:14 -0500, Martin Eastburn

What are you talking about? There have been no new offshore federal leases issued in California since 1984. Are you talking about state leases? Which ones?

No. There are as many oil rigs operating or contracted in the Gulf today as were predicted for 2013 before the BP oil spill.

No. The nearest exploratory rig off Cuba is over 200 miles from Miami. And it's Cuba and Russia, in this case. It was the last rig off Cuba's coast. It just shut down and is being moved to South America.

I can't chase all of your claims down, Martin. Without citations, they just aren't worth tracking.
--
Ed Huntress


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I don't know much about the Mormons. From what little I've seen, they tend to be pretty well educated, in general. I'm sure there are exceptions.
It looks more like paleo-conservative cynicism to me. Things have to be going wrong, and it has to be somebody else's fault -- especially if there are any non-conservatives in power. We're on the road to perdition and no amount of evidence to the contrary will be considered.
It turns their minds into oatmeal and they're incapable of examining evidence in an objective way.
--
Ed Huntress

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On 6/30/13 5:52 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Conventional wisdom here in farm country is that the feed value of corn is unaffected by ethanol production. The left over distillers grains have as much feed value as the kernel corn.
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On 6/30/2013 8:29 PM, Dean Hoffman > wrote:

Take the fine hand of the government mandating that so much ethanol must be used in fuel each year and consider that crop yields can vary considerably from season to season. In years of poor yield, this takes away from the food market as ethanol is mandated and price of food goes way up. Been happening.
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On 6/30/13 7:49 PM, Frank wrote:

As much of the crop goes into booze as into cereal: http://tinyurl.com/l2czsbk There are more charts like this floating around the web if you're interested. http://tinyurl.com/mh89aa4 The raw material cost of the food is overshadowed by the retailing costs much of the time.
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The cooking oil sounds good, except that I doubt that there is enough in an average town to power a tenth of a percent of the cars,
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Ralph Mowery wrote:

That was my point. OTOH, you could render enough fat from the shiftless slobs to power at least one percent. ;-)
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17:49:02 -0400 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

    Hmm, there's a new "energy source".
-- pyotr filipivich "With Age comes Wisdom. Although more often, Age travels alone."
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