Dishwasher - don't rinse first?

[krw]

Why would she bother washing them after she'd scrapped them?

I'd give SWMBO a black eye for scrapping the dishes instead of washing them.

[Douglas Johnson]

Oh, the irony.

-- Doug

[krw]

Fact irony, though lefties are too stupid to tell the difference.

[Robert Green]

I admire your hopeful nature but this sort of "hijacking" is a deliberate action meant to provoke conflict by people that enjoy watching people argue. They're clearly not here to help or to learn, just to make it harder for those that actually do want to assist others.

My psychologist friend says they are subconsciously trying to recreate the conditions of a bad childhood where their parents were likely arguing in front of them incessantly. They take a perverse comfort in seeing people fight that most normal people can't fathom. For them, it's a sort of very sick "I'm home again" feeling that brings them perverse comfort. Sort of like Anthony Perkins in the movie "Psycho." It's actually very sad.

As Dan E. has pointed out, there's one way to deal with it - the killfile. Sadly, no matter how many seeds you plant in sterile, poisoned ground, they will never grow.

[Robert Green]

Precisely. Although I used to be very concerned that the six or seven worst-case hijackers here would give bad advice to newbies and needed to be "watched" I finally relented. That's when I began evaluating the motives and overall "helpfulness" of posters. Scolders and hijackers got marked down and when it was clear that more than half their posts were worthless, I kill-filed them. It was a remarkably quick process for some of them.

I've debated whether I should post my twit list and the posts that got people elected to it for newbies to consider, but since most of the newbies in AHR these days seem to be sock puppets meant to bypass existing twit lists, it seemed "unhelpful" in the long run.

Using a kill file has been a remarkably positive change because I no longer feel compelled to correct the massive amounts of deliberate misinformation (along with the sheer stupidity) that the thread hijackers spew.

I now believe that anyone who agrees with them is either a sick sock puppet or not amenable to changing their opinions through logical discussion. Doing so is not only a waste of time, but is *exactly* what they want. People who spend precious time debating with them have that much less time to help people with legitimate home repair problems. That makes two good reasons to twit list the hijackers.

I also believe that it won't be long before any newbie arriving here reaches the same conclusion. Seeing new people react incredulously to some of the flame bait that's constantly churned out renewed my faith in people.

The question I face now is do I twit-list the "good" posters that feel constantly compelled to feed these trolls? Sadly, I think the answer is going to be a resounding "yes." Feeding trolls is not nearly as bad as trolling, but it enables trolls to do their dirty work and shouldn't be encouraged.

Let's just hope that fewer and fewer "good" posters feel the need to respond to any of these hijackers and that the "jackers" are then compelled to argue amongst themselves. Like you, I only see certain bad posters when good ones respond to their trolling.

Of course, knowing that they are being kill-filed will cause a number of them to nym-shift. Fortunately, these sock puppets betray themselves eventually (and pretty quickly since they are basically one-trick ponies) and when they do, my twit-list awaits. Unfortunately some smart people with valuable insight are so rude and belligerent I've had to twit-list them too. Let's hope they are smart enough to eventually realize that their bad attitude results in them being "thread enders" - the kind of people that end threads because no one will engage them.

[Robert Green]

Agreed. I've thought about posting a list of all the names of intelligent, thoughtful posters who have either bailed completely or gone into lurking mode and ask what happened to them.

When I look through my cache of stored messages from years gone by there are many posters who seem to have disappeared after being savaged by the same old six or seven posters that just can't control their anger. I admire Higgs Boson for sticking around after being called an "old bag" and really feel sad that no one points out that sort of name-calling behavior is just not acceptable among normal human beings. It's the last childish resort of an emotionally defective person that somehow never managed to grow up.

What these hijackers are trying to do is just "ethnic cleansing" on a small scale. They are determined to drive off others who present facts and opinions that are different so they can wallow in a mud pit full of like-minded people ("minded" may be to strong). The best way to combat that sort of sick thought process is to totally ignore them. It makes them even more vile in their vituperation and although they don't realize it, sabotages whatever valid points they were trying to make.

It also makes it quite obvious to newcomers that they are being deliberately isolated and are not representative of the bulk of AHR posters, most of whom are dedicated to helping others with home repair problems.

[DerbyDad03]

One can hope, one can always hope. :-)

[Douglas Johnson]

And the irony keeps on coming.

-- Doug

[Higgs Boson]

My amateur diagnosis is that they don't HAVE a life. They have made THIS th eir life. Maybe not so far off from your shrink friend's call. The scary part is their hatred of women, expressed in the most vulgar terms, even whe n referring to spouse. Not hard to guess the diagnostic shrink term for TH AT syndrome ! [...]

The normal people who come here to get or give useful technical info usuall y get results within 'n' responses. I doubt whether "normal" users would b e turned off by the crazies; they'd probably be sophisticated enough to [ve rb?) the grain from the chaff. Faut de mieux, there's the killfile.

Now, on to a 96-year-old solar pioneer casting doubt on the technology. Ya wn. Tomorrow, on new thread.

Pax vobiscum

HB

[krw]

Well, you do keep posting.

[Dan Espen]

Vain hope. How long has Malcolm been at it?

Every time I post recommending a kill file, I get emails asking how do you use a kill file.

Sorry but there is no cook book answer. Kill files are a feature of the client software you use to read Usenet. It's my understanding that every tool that can directly access Usenet has a kill file feature. I don't even know if Google Groups or Homeownwers hub has an equivalent.

Assuming your client software is up to the task, you'll probably find the feature under a label like "ignore".

[Robert Green]

Hope stinks infernal in the human breast - no, that's not right. Hope

*springs eternal* in the human breast.

In the kingdom of winter, there is no hope. No, wait, that's not right either!

In the kingdom of hope, there is no winter!

[Robert Green]

Fortunately now I only see that sort of misogyny when someone I haven't twit-listed responds to one of the women-haters club - which reminds me of "Our Gang" and further proves that most of the anti-social posters here are still mired in an unhappy childhood.

Et cum spirit tuo.

[Robert Green]

Amen! My new Panasonic cordless phones come with a belt loop but STILL no way to lock out the keypad from bump dialing. I have to imagine that not one of those designers ever walked around the house with the phone on their belt. I finally made a protective sleeve made out of a plastic water bottle to keep from magically dialing out every time I brushed up against a counterop.

My cleaning woman said the same of the Dyson vacuum one of her clients has. She assures me that Mr. Dyson never had to carry that stinking thing up four flights of stairs.

[Wayne Boatwright]

On Thu 14 Nov 2013 03:57:59a, Ed Pawlowski told us...

The instructions for our 1-1/2 year old Bosch DW specificaly indicated no pre-washing or rinsing. It will even removed all but the very worst burnt on residue on a baking dish. I don't remember offhand if they recomnmended a specific detergent or rinse agent, but I use the Cascade Complete pillows, along with Oxi-Clean Diswasher Booster in the rinse agent dispenser. Phoenix is known for particularly hard water, but we have absolutely spotless dishware and glasses, and even plastic ware.

Once a month (or when I remember) I use a diswasher cleaner (haven't tried the Afresh brand yet), but I do use Afresh cleaner in our Maytag front load clothes washer.

FWIW, for those folks who complain about mold or mildrew in their f/l clothes washers, their failure to leave the door open either betwen washing sessions, or at least until the areas around and within the seals are dry is usually the cause.

[Wayne Boatwright]

On Thu 14 Nov 2013 03:09:28p, Tony Hwang told us...

Our Bosch DW has such a sensor if one chooses the "auto" cycle. Works flawlessly.

[Wayne Boatwright]

On Fri 22 Nov 2013 07:59:42a, Robert Green told us...

Anyoee with 4 flights of stairs should own more than one vacuum.

[Ed Pawlowski]

To follow up, I've switched 100% to Cascade Platinum tables. The difference is amazing and the dishes sparkle like new. I put in a 30 year old CorningWare dish and you cannot tell it from a brand new one. I'm amazed at everything coming out of the DW. I don't know how much to attribute to the machine and how much to the detergent, but as a team, they do a fantastic job.

I bought the Cascade at BJ's and it works out toe 21¢ a load. At the local supermarket they were near twice that.

[krw]

The turn-off about the Bosch was the "screen" rather than having a grinder. They get disgusting and it's one more thing to keep clean.

We've never had to use a "dishwasher cleaner". If it can't clean itself, how clean is it getting the dishes?

No, we're not about to leave the door of a front-loader open. Top-loader, sure, but requiring that a front-loader be left open is nuts.

[Wayne Boatwright]

On Fri 06 Dec 2013 11:57:14a, Ed Pawlowski told us...

Ed, I trieed a bucket of Cascade Platinum, but found that in my DW with my local water conditions, the Cascade Complete actually did a better job. I've no idea why.