Boric Acid for ants -where to get

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Go to grocery store or back to hardware store. Look for Borax "20 Mule" or some such thing. Its a common, old fashioned, general purpose cleaner and laundry detergent. See http://www.dialcorp.com/index.cfm?page_idU Other brands as well.

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I use boric acid ointment for chapped lips. If you Google "boric acid powder", this is one of the sites that comes up. http://alsnetbiz.com/homeimprovement/boric_acid.html . OT, I use a mixture of castor oil & liquid soap to get rid of ground hogs & moles. You can't use unscented castor oil, because it's the smell that they hate. http://www.baar.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code 1&Category_Code=LWN

Would
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Hi Rich,
We buy our borax at the supermarket. Works great mixed with jam or honey. As soon as the ants recognise the mix as being bad, change the jam to another flavour. Usually takes about 3 or 4 days to kill out a nest.
Cheers, Larry Australia
RichK wrote: : Hi, : : Where does one buy Boric Acid? Local hardware store did not have it. : Would like to mix my own for ant control. : : Rich
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RichK wrote:

Home Depot has it. I bought a couple of plastic bottles (pownder) of them last year. The bottles were labeled something like "Roach, ant killer, 99% boric acid" or some such.
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That's what I use. Sometimes it works but on those nasty little white foot bastards all it does is teach them to eat another food. I mix it about one part in 12 to the food they are eating. I never had sweet ants, they all were grease ants. The little white foot bastards got so good they would only eat dog food if the dog had it in his mouth first. I finally got rid of them with a nasty perimeter spray along with spot spraying the suspected nesting areas.
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:) Where does one buy Boric Acid? Local hardware store did not have it. Would :) like to mix my own for ant control. :) Unless you are just trying to cut costs, just about every other ant product on the market will be less toxic, more effective and less hassle to use than mixing up BA mixtures you usually come across on the web. You might find it at a local pharmacy.
--
Lar

Oh, if only Noah would of been a bit more wise,
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Wrong.
Ask me how I know.
Ants around here won't TOUCH commercial ant baits. However they DEVOUR homemade baits.
BTW, there's not much that's LESS toxic than boric acid (eye wash) or sodium borate (laundry detergent booster).
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says...
:) :) > Unless you are just trying to cut costs, just about every other ant :) > product on the market will be less toxic, more effective :) :) Wrong. :) :) Ask me how I know. :) :) Ants around here won't TOUCH commercial ant baits. However they DEVOUR :) homemade baits. If they are attracted to a food source it doesn't really matter if it is a commercial or a home made mixture, they need to eat it to be effected. If you have protein feeding ants and you buy a sugar bait they won't eat it...if you have ants feeding on sugars and you mix a protein based mixture, they probably won't feed on it. Where as you have ant getting into spilt jelly, you will get results on a home made sugar bait. :) BTW, there's not much that's LESS toxic than boric acid (eye wash) or :) sodium borate (laundry detergent booster). :) Eye wash's are not boric acid...eye washes are a solution that contains a percentage of BA...eye drops can contain Hydrochloric Acid, but I would hardly claim hydrochloric acid could be used as an eye drop. As with most insecticides the amount of active ingredient used is a percentage in the solution, boric acid "solutions" are more times than not more toxic than than other insecticides, after all about 1/5 of a tablespoon of BA will have a 50% chance of killing a 2.2 lb animal.
--
Lar

Oh, if only Noah would of been a bit more wise,
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wrote:

Take away the motive (sugar/protein), don't they die also by walking on boric acid?
Oren "My doctor says I have a malformed public-duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fiber, and that I am therefore excused from saving Universes."
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says...
:) wrote: :) :) >If they are attracted to a food source it doesn't really matter if it is :) >a commercial or a home made mixture, they need to eat it to be effected. :) >If you have protein feeding ants and you buy a sugar bait they won't eat :) >it...if you have ants feeding on sugars and you mix a protein based :) >mixture, they probably won't feed on it. Where as you have ant getting :) >into spilt jelly, you will get results on a home made sugar bait. :) :) Take away the motive (sugar/protein), don't they die also by walking :) on boric acid? :) :) :) Oren :) "My doctor says I have a malformed public-duty gland :) and a natural deficiency in moral fiber, and that I am therefore :) excused from saving Universes." :) When using it as a powder it is most effective if you can barely see the coverage. As insects crawl through it, it adheres to tiny hairs and they then ingest the BA while grooming causing death. There is a slower action in way of desiccation in which they may also die. But, the down fall to BA is that when used as a dust it usually is way over used acting as a repellant, just moving the insect out of sight giving the appearance of effectiveness, but not really solving the problem.
--
Lar

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Lar wrote:

You are wrong because you are thinking of commercial products that can contain all sorts of stuff. Boric acid about 1 tsp per cup of water is a (once was the) standard eye wash. It is 1 tsp/cup because that is about all that will dissolve in warm water. Toxicity depends on where you apply it. BO applied to the skin Boric Acid is fairly benign/beneficial, applied internally it is not so good.
Of course you could just use dilute salt water as an eyewash, but it wouldn't have the disinfectant capability of boric acid.
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well, i guess all the animals i care about are bigger than a kilo (assuming your figures above are correct, which i don't, sorry)
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says... :) > after all about 1/5 of a tablespoon of BA will have a 50% chance of :) > killing a 2.2 lb animal. :) :) well, i guess all the animals i care about are bigger than a kilo :) (assuming your figures above are correct, which i don't, sorry) :) :) Well, assuming you are familiar with a number all chemicals are given which will allow them to be compared to other chemicals.. the LD50 is how many milligrams of a chemical that it takes to kill 50% of test subjects per 1 kilogram. The smaller the number the more toxic. I.E. 1 tablespoon of boric acid (LD50 2660) is more toxic than a tablespoon consisting table salt (LD50 3700). With BA having a LD50 of 2660 it is easy enough to figure out since there are roughly 14175 milligrams in a tablespoon, just under 1/5 (2660 mg) is enough to have a 50% chance of killing a 2.2 lb (or 1 kilogram) creature.
--
Lar

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well, let's see, Einstein:
i weigh about 80 kilos.
that means i would need to eat (1/5) x 80 or 16 Tablespoons (which equals one CUP) of boric acid to have a 50% chance of croaking.
ant baits use about 1/2 tsp of BA per cup of bait.
1/2 tsp = 1/6 Tbsp.
that means that to consume 16 Tablespoons of BA, i would need to eat approximately 96 cups or SIX GALLONS of prepared ant bait to have a 50% chance of croaking.
gee, i guess you're right: this IS a TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE DANGER!
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says...
:)
says... :) > :) > after all about 1/5 of a tablespoon of BA will have a 50% chance :) > of :) > killing a 2.2 lb animal. :) > :) :) well, i guess all the animals i care about are bigger than a :) > kilo :) (assuming your figures above are correct, which i don't, sorry) :) > :) :) Well, assuming you are familiar with a number all chemicals are :) > given which will allow them to be compared to other chemicals.. the :) > LD50 is how many milligrams of a chemical that it takes to kill 50% of :) > test subjects per 1 kilogram. The smaller the number the more toxic. :) > I.E. 1 tablespoon of boric acid (LD50 2660) is more toxic than a :) > tablespoon consisting table salt (LD50 3700). With BA having a LD50 of :) > 2660 it is easy enough to figure out since there are roughly 14175 :) > milligrams in a tablespoon, just under 1/5 (2660 mg) is enough to have :) > a 50% chance of killing a 2.2 lb (or 1 kilogram) creature. :) :) well, let's see, Einstein: :) :) i weigh about 80 kilos. :) :) that means i would need to eat (1/5) x 80 or 16 Tablespoons (which :) equals one CUP) of boric acid to have a 50% chance of croaking. :) :) ant baits use about 1/2 tsp of BA per cup of bait. :) :) 1/2 tsp = 1/6 Tbsp. :) :) that means that to consume 16 Tablespoons of BA, i would need to eat :) approximately 96 cups or SIX GALLONS of prepared ant bait to have a 50% :) chance of croaking. :) :) gee, i guess you're right: this IS a TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE DANGER! :) :) :) O.K. Brainiac..right about what? Where did I type that using boric acid ant bait puts one in terrible danger. Follow the thread you'll see where I asked why go the hassle of making it when there are numerous alternatives that are as safe if not safer than making a mixture ranging from 8%-33% (which most directions seem to be). You responded earlier that I am wrong because you have failed using commercial baits (a trick if it is the "disk" type baits would be to dunk them under warm water for a second to freshen them up) and have had success using home made mixtures, well I make my living using commercial baits/treatments. Being self employed, it would only make since for me to use the most cost efficient and effective products be it bought or I make the mixture myself. I guess with as an elaborate reply you posted you have changed your mind and assume my figures were correct..... In your situation you may not be worried about yourself eating the cup worth of BA, but what about countless others that hear nothing but how safe boric acid is to use around the home...boric acid is harmless... when what I often see in homes I visit is a jar lid of jelly bait on the floor or counter top in easy access of a kitten/dog/child that does weigh quite a bit less than your 175 lbs or so and there is no antidote for borate poisoning.
--
Lar

Oh, if only Noah would of been a bit more wise,
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Oh yeah? Like what?
The active ingredient in my commercial ant traps is chlorpyrifos (Dursban).
The LD50 toxicity of chlorpyrifos in rats is about 150mg/kg.
You claim the LD50 toxicity of boric acid is 2,660 mg/kg.
If so, that means chlorpyrifos is nearly 18 times as toxic as boric acid.
Yes, the Dursban is only 0.03% concentration in the ant traps.
I honestly don't have the interest or ambition at this point to run all the numbers, but let's just put it this way: I seriously doubt you'd need to eat SIX GALLONS worth of Dursban-laced ant bait to reach a LD50 dosage level, as you would with my homebrew borax/boric acid bait.
More to the point, homemade baits can be modified on the fly to appeal to what the ants seem to want to eat, which means they WORK. Not ONE of the commercial preparations I've tried has EVER worked.
And so far, I've somehow survived the urge to eat 6 gallons of borax bait...my 50-pound dog has yet to eat nearly 2 gallons of it, and my 20-pound daughter has yet to eat nearly 3 quarts of the stuff. Hell, I mix the stuff up by the CUP. About the only creature that could kill (assuming the animal ate the ENTIRE CUP) would be a mouse or a rat. Which would be fine with me.
If you came here for an argument, you'd better go and find Monty Python.
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a tablespoon of boric acid weighs a HALF OUNCE???
i don't know where you get YOUR boric acid (Department of Energy, maybe?) but MY boric acid weighs about FOUR grams/Tbsp., not 14.
are you sure you're not weighing uranium cake?
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Actually, you're *both* wrong.
The density of boric acid is 2.486 g/cc. One tablespoon = 14.78 cc. Thus one tablespoon of boric acid has a mass of slighly less than 6 grams.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
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Try again. One tablespoon is 14.78 cc. Boric acid weighs 2.486 g/cc, or slightly less than 6 grams per tablespoon -- not fourteen.
You're also ignoring the fact that the LD50 varies from species to species, in some cases considerably. LD50 numbers are *never* expressed simply as "LD50" by those who understand what they mean: invariably, they are expressed as "LD50 in mice", "... in rabbits", or in whatever species was tested.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
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Lar wrote:

--
Lar

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