Veterans :

[Ron]

Veterans : Thank GOD for Veterans. Thank all of you Veterans for your service to our country. God Bless Millwright Ron

[Swingman]

And a big Thank You!, from a Veteran, for the thought behind your post!

[Robatoy]

A big genuine THANK YOU to all vintages of Veterans. Some I know well. That takes a special kind of human to volunteer for that kinda work.

My dear Angela's father was a grunt in WW2 and came home to raise 4 men and my wife, all of them left with a purpose to make the world a better place.

Respectfully, I submit my deepest gratitude.

Rob

[Han]

Robatoy wrote in news:321875ba-ebbc-4e23-bd3a- [e-mail]:

I second that sentiment. Born October 1944 in nazi-occupied Holland.

[Curran Copeland]

Every year about this time I set and think about friends I will never talk with or see again, friends I have lost touch with but still stand tall in my memories,and friends who still stand with me even over many miles and years, "Companions" who stood with me that I never knew, all who wore or wear the uniform of this their country. I am proud to have walked with you and may 'God bless you every one

[Robatoy]

My school in Alphen, wore the scars of bullets. Some big holes, obviously re-bricked. It was near a railroad line, between Leiden and Utrecht. I was born later in the 40's but old enough to see and remember the devastation in downtown Rotterdam. I also played hide and seek in many pillbox bunkers and abandoned tanks. We, as kids, found lots and lots of empty shell casings. (The latter, we would strap onto Dinky Toys and fill them with KCLO3 and sugar and made fun rocket cars.)

I also recall some neighbourhoods being evacuated because yet another UXB would be found.

[Han]

Robatoy wrote in news: [e-mail]:

I grew up in Wageningen, which was frontline in 1940 during the 5-day battle of the Grebbe line. Then again in the fall and winter of 1944/5 after Operation Market Garden failed. I was born in Hilversum, though, at least 50 miles away. I walked many times in the Airborn walking tour in Oosterbeek.

[mac davis]

Thank you, Ron... Damn, it's been almost 40 friggin' years now!

I sent my first "Happy Vet's Day" email to our son today... Back from Iraq last month with all body parts intact..

mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

[Han]

mac davis wrote in news: [e-mail]:

Congratulations to your son and thanks for his efforts on behalf of civilization. I have always been against the war in Iraq, but that enmity is against the socalled leaders who got us into that war, not against the service personnel who carry out the job. Hopefully all will be back soon, and we can all be civilized soon.

[Robatoy]

[e-mail]:

Idem.

[mac davis]

I sure hope you're right... He only has a 90 day "window" before they can deploy him again for another 15 months..

My feelings, probably tainted by my experience in Nam, is that we probably did the right thing initially, which was to stop invasion of neighboring countries... Once we did that, it was time to say "we won" and get our people back home..

As you said, I support our people in harm's way, but not always the people that sent them there..

mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

[Swingman]

"mac davis" wrote

I agree ... regardless of whether pundits want to consider the war won or lost, I was in beaucoup battles in Nam and never lost a one!

And to this day, I would work up a good spit for both Robert McNamara and Westmoreland were the opportunity to arise.

( Actually missed the chance with McNamara, but was too busy staying alive to grasp the vileness of the situation)

[Charlie Groh]

...I flew scouts in a Cav Troop...always came home with a broomstick tied to the periscope...heh...

...I'll save some for LBJ, brother. The Tonkin Gulf Resolution alone accounted for 90% of us guys being sent over there...and *it* was based on fabrication of events...

...I hear you, bro!

Charlie Groh

[Swingman]

"Charlie Groh" wrote

Hehe ... A clean sweep!

"When will we ever learn ..."

Good talking to you, Charlie .... thanks for the mammaries! (I didn't get to see Bob Hope either)

[Charlie Groh]

...we got Mamie Van Doren in our O-club once...our CO ran off with her to Hawaii! Yup...we troopers only got to imagine...sigh...

cg

[J. Clarke]

Ever read "Giap"? He knew he had been beaten and said as much. Shame that American schoolteachers aren't as honest.

As for saying "we won" and then going home, why bother? If you do that you're going to keep fighting the same war over and over again. Either finish the job or don't start it.

The trouble with Iraq is that we're trying to rush the "finishing the job" part of it and it's going to end up a mess. Have you ever read the Iraqi constitution? It pays lip service to a lot of high ideals but has no checks and balances and mechanisms for guaranteeing those ideals.

[Swingman]

"Charlie Groh" wrote

Swingman"

tsk, tsk ... we had to make do with the occasional Doughnut Dolly fly in.

Our battalion HQ O-club, in Ban Me Thuot, which I got to about once a month, was sandbagged ammo box walls, with sandbagged PSP over head, and a plywood floor, and FULLY equipped with a PacEx tape deck and a pop corn machine ... providing Charlie hadn't knocked out the generator with an RPG that particular night.

In the 5th Special Forces O-club in Nha Trang, the only other one I ever got close to while in country, they had "top notch" entertainment ... like the ubiquitous, third rate, Filipino rock 'n roll band, who played "Magic Carpet Ride" at least once every set. :(

But, a hot shower and clean sheets was much more important!

[Charlie Groh]

...I get the same feeling...Nam all over again when we pull out. Hope not...

...didn't we "help" them write their document? If so, why not in our image?

cg

[Charlie Groh]

Oh, a buddy of mine turned me on to "The Fall of Saigon" (an account by a French author/reporter whom I can't seem to find the name of right now...sheesh)...that, along with seeing documentation that I trusted about Tonkin, was quite the mental watershed. We had no business being involved in a Civil War...

cg

[Charlie Groh]

OK, after checking thoroughly: "Giai Phong! The Fall and Liberation of Saigon" by Tiziano Terzani (that noted *French* author...heh). Great read.

cg