Are any of your employees buying those used saws? Just for the purposes of
discussion, it would be interesting to know how many of them would buy those
older saw while at the same time being aware of why they are up for sale.
Any of those saws a General 650-T50 or 350-T50 ? If so I might be interested
in one. And considering the topic at hand, the cost of a Sawstop is out of
my reach, whereas a regular tablesaw is not out of reach. For me, anyway,
it's a matter of having a standard cabinet saw or not having one at all.
That "tad costly" has to be considered minimal when that accident(s) happen.
And of course, you're a business. You have a responsibility to the safety of
your employees. Failure to adhere to that responsibility could cost LV
dearly. I don't believe the average home owner would have the same viewpoint
to safety that you're forced to adopt.
Ah, well, it was the first time I had seen or heard of it. Expensive
and probably does have other problems (I'll read the previous writeups
if I can find them). But still ... it's just sooooo cool.
On Sun, 26 Feb 2006 17:58:47 -0700, "mywebaccts (at) PLUGcomcast.net"
<"mywebaccts (at) PLUGcomcast.net"> wrote:
That's what I expected, but from the (purely paper) details I've seen so
far it appears to be a good high-end saw at a good price.
However I would never touch one of this company's products. The gimmick
is a partial solution at best (simple guards already avoid most of these
problems and it does nothing to stop kickback). Trying to enforce
regulation to sell their product is underhand at best.
Well, now I am really confused. You don't care, but you had to ask
anyway. Just nosy?
Since I didn't post anything that required any kind of internet branded
bravery, I can only assume you want my name for your Christmas list....
or maybe a long walk in the moonlight. So let me give you some real
info about me. Let's not get hung up on names... I don't even care if
Dave isn't your real name...
For my birthday, I would like nice steak and a good cabernet. Some
roses would be nice too, you rascal. Gift certificates are always
nice... I'm pretty easy to get along with.
And I did catch your earlier explusion of disbelief:
I checked with Mom, and big guy, it is indeed Robert. Whew!
I hope that doesn't mean I am off the Christmas card list.
Robert (for real!)
The biggest problem I have with it is that it's really unnecessary. A
woodworker exercising reasonable caution has nothing to fear from the
tablesaw, and anyone who is so terrified of it probably shouldn't be
using it in the first place. There are thousands and thousands of
woodworkers out there who have all of their fingers and toes after
years of woodworking and they didn't need more than the guards and
splitters that came with the tablesaw.
The safety saw is ridiculously expensive for what you get, and
whenever it goes off, for whatever reason, it ruins your expensive saw
blade, plus requires you to buy a new expensive brake insert. These
things don't reset, people, you have to throw it away and start over
fresh. And as you say, it doesn't do a thing against kickback and
other real hazards.
And there are thousands and thousands that have lost their fingers. Have
you ever cut yourself ,EVER, with a knife? A lapse of judgement can be
quite costly and NO ONE is incapable of having an accident regardless of how
safely you think you operate a TS.
It certainly is not necesssary but if you can afford it, it's well worth
I would rather the saw falsely trip 30 times and correctly on the 31st time
than not trip at all.
Well in your own words, A woodworker exercising reasonable caution has
nothing to fear from the
tablesaw. With proper caution a kick back is not going to harm you either.
That said, the saw does indeed have a riving knife that goes a long way in
I wish you luck and to remain safe with your wood working.
<<Ahh, but that could never happen. If your saw tripped falsely 30
you'd have hung yourself long before then.>>
HAH! No kiddin'!.
On another note, I going to have to remember the logic in this thread
when one of these guys has his teenage kiddo (who has used all tools
since birth under strict supervision) whack off a finger due to a lapse
in judgement. Or when one of the guys gets his shirt caught in a
machine and it yanks him in (I am thinking of those farmers that have
lost arms, etc. that I used to feel sorry for; now, set straight by
this group I think they may have deserved it), or maybe in a crowded
shop someone trips and falls on the machine. I will then post this
thread so you can remember that you don't need additional protection,
and if you or yours did something to yourself by accident, you may have
I think that some are forgetting that professionals that use tools all
day long get tired, but still have to work. They are sick, but still
need to pay bills. You get tired, and in a Cinderella world, you go
home and rest. But in the real world, deadlines loom. And the more
tired you are, the more mistakes you make and the more accident prone
you are. There is also the probablility of scale. Dinking around in
your garage screwing with the tools when it isn't football season,
holidays, family birthdays, anniversaries and on an on it not the same
as doing work with machinery all day long, day in and day out.
Not everyone is some hobby guy working in half his garage when his wife
lets him make a box or two for the grandkids, or put up a new shelf as
a weekend project. If you use tools enough, you will get hurt.
I think the saw is properly positioned in the market place. If you
don't need it or want it, you don't have to buy it. What a concept.
And those that do, can. And since some like the concept, that doesn't
make them some kind of candy assed weenie. I would probably have them
if I did more cabinets since I would feel better about they guys
working with a table saw with a blade brake.
Many years ago I saw a young man slip on the concrete (clean by the
way, it was an accident) while he was ripping MDF for new formica tops.
He was at the end of the rip so he was pushing the 16" wide piece from
the back, and in that position he thought he was going to go head first
in the saw. He got both hands out to stop himself, but one came up a
finger short. We finally found the finger, but at that time they were
unable to connect anything more than the vessels, so it shrank up some
after they sewed it on, but never worked right again. I know, I know.
He never should have slipped in the first place.
And here's the topper for those that are worried about the cost. Since
they reported have the brake problems all worked out, if you never
stick your hot dog in the damn blade, it will never fire off, and you
will never ruin your blade or the brake shoe. Just like I tell the
guys that work for me, learn to keep your hot dog out of trouble and
you will be a lot safer and happier. Wait... maybe it wasn't actually
a hot dog when I was talking to them...
I was thinking of an accident happening through no fault of your own. The
dog comes in and brushes against your leg distracting you. Something falls
off a shelf startling you. A power failure plunges you into darkness and you
slip against the still spinning blade in the dark.
The more I read about this, the more I'm thinking a Sawstop is a pretty good
idea, especially considering that I work from an awkward height ~ sitting in
a wheelchair. But, for me anyway, it's way out of my financial reach.
Besides, if I cut off a finger, it won't cost me anything up front, except a
lot of pain and cursing. One advantage anyway, of our Canadian medical
I don't recall anything about Sawstop still working for any length of
time after the power goes out to prevent this. The owners manual
http://www.sawstop.com/Cabinet_Saw_Manual.pdf page 11 of 100 says "To
prevent loss of Sawstop protection during coast down, do not turn off
main power until blade has stopped spinning."
UPS for a table saw?
I was referring to a residential power failure, not someone turning off the
main power. It only takes a fraction of a second to cut off a finger. As far
as I know, other than it's safety feature, the sawstop doesn't have a brake,
so it will take a few seconds to spin down.
All in how you look at it. You can accept blame for just about
anything--you could have prevented it. But that's the reason to take
all reasonable safety precautions. To me, it's not a question of
whether saw stop is a good idea--it's just whether it is reasonable at
You fault. Why didn't you have a door closed or barrier up to prevent
You fault. You should stack things more carefully, and anticipate what
might happen if they fall.
Your fault. You mean you didn't install a backup power supply on your
I'm fully ambulatory, but I feel exactly the same way.
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.
Aren't you reaching a bit? I know the technology exists for backup power
supplies, but honestly, how many people do you know who have set it up. A
computer, electronic equipment, ok, but general house or workshop lighting?
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