I hear you... to some extent. The "fact" is though, there is no health
benefit to smoking to anyone concerned. When the (US and some others) gov.
figured out the detrimental effects of asbestos, it was outlawed. Do you
support the right to choose to use or quit using asbestos? The same goes
for lead in paint or water pipes, for that matter... or DDT to control
mosquitos... or a bunch of other stuff currently illegal to use.
I have smoked. Up to 3 packs a day and for 35 or so years. I quit 4 1/2
yrs ago. I still love the smell of the stuff... I never cared about people
smoking in restaurants or much of anywhere. Truth be told, sometimes I
stand downwind of smokers, on purpose. What I'm saying is that my opinion
is *not* based on overzealous, holier-than-thou ex-smoker hoo-haw. The
*facts* are overwhelming against smoking. A lot of the public perception
is based on carefully orchestrated science based campaigns to sell us the
Sorry, I think the days of smoking are numbered and I think it is a good
thing. I think that *is* the function of government.
Hear ya. I quit smoking a little later than that, and admittedly
slipped in a puff, now and then, in later years. I allow myself a
celebratory cigar about once a year. but I have been pretty clean for
the past 15 years.
We had a couple of bars in the Wichita area that make wonderful, old-
fashioned hamburgers. I really enjoyed the hamburgers, but secretly
enjoyed the smoke.
Nope, that's the government _setting_ the smoking policy.
If someone wants to hang a sign on the door that says "smokers of pipes,
cigars, cigarettes, and tiparillos are welcome in this establishment and
anybody who doesn't want to be exposed to smoke is asked to take their
business elsewhere instead of coming in here and whining about it" they
should be able to.
The result of the current laws is that there are already smokeasies open in
Why are you people so bound and determined to create a new income source for
Let the market decide.
Smoke-free restaurants and smoking restaurants. Or separate sections in the
This simple solution is, however, insufficient for the True Believer (see
the book by the same name by Eric Hoffer).
People mind their own business when it's worth minding. When it's not, they
take their mind off their own meaningless affairs by minding someone else's
These folks are, nevertheless, a source of some amusement. Whenever some
granny-lady starts whacking me with her umbrella and screeching in a voice
that has not endeared her to any number of husbands: "You godless communist,
you can't smoke here!," I simply reply: "It's all right, madam, I'm French."
I smoked for a long time, quit about 7-8 years ago. I really notice the
smoke, but don't bitch about it.
I agree with you. Let the market decide.
The businesses that catered to smokers would attract that business, and
Kiva - Loans that change lives.
Back several years ago when AZ went the "smoke-free" path, a restaurant
owner wanted to turn his restaurant into a "smoking club". To a reasonable
person, this seemed pretty reasonable, there are lots of restaurants in
Tucson and there would be no doubt what one would be walking into if you
entered this person's establishment. To a reasonable person. Reality?
Full force of the law came down on this guy's head. How dare he think that
he could run HIS business as he saw fit?!
If you're going to be dumb, you better be tough
But just think what could have happened if they had allowed it...
The club is a rousing success, filled with patrons happily puffing away.
One of them opens the door to leave and at that very moment an innocent
non-smoker is passing by. WHAM! That innocent inhales - ACTUALLY INHALES -
a whiff of the transient smoke and now has to live with the certain
knowledge that his/her life has been shortened and may end painfully and
slowly from lung cancer.
Arizona - and California, Washington, New York, Florida, et al - knows best.
So does big brother.
Wonder what would happen if you advertised for something (a job, selling
chia plants, tutoring, offering a kitten for adoption, etc.) and said in
your ad "smokers only need apply?" That is, who would get their panties in a
wad if you discriminated against non-smokers?
Yeah, but was anybody preventing a "well behaved" non-smoker from
walking into that smoking club and having a good time in spite of the
smoke? I doubt there was there a sign on the door of the club that said
"Non-smokers not allowed", so I don't see now they could have shut it
down because of discrimination.
Any given amount of traffic flow, no matter how
sparse, will expand to fill all available lanes.
Once upon a time, a fried-chicken joint in Kentucky applied for a Service
Mark ("Ford has a better idea" "Coke's the real thing") from the
Commissioner of Patents and Trademarks. Several groups objected the the
issuance of the service mark and a notice was placed in the Federal Register
regarding the form and times for commentary.
In my view, the service mark "Jack's Fried Chicken, where a breast in the
mouth is as good as a thigh in the hand" would have been a self-correcting
problem. Either Jack would have made a fortune or somebody would have burnt
his place to the ground.
But noooo! We had to have notices in the Federal Register, meetings
hearings, documents in triplicates, writs by the wagon full, twelve lawyers
singing, notaries public without number.
And I've watched what amounts to the reverse. Mother and son doing some
shopping in the supermarket. The kid was pretty big, I figure about 10 years
old. He wanted his mother to buy him things as they were walking around and
she was refusing. He was punching, kicking and slapping her because he'd put
something in the shopping cart and she'd put it back on the shelf.
They weren't speaking English so there wasn't much I could say. I was sorely
tempted to slap the kid silly, but I didn't really feel like spending time
There was a case where some kid was just losing it and wailing away in
a supermarket. The kids mother pretended not to hear any of it. This
kid was apparently shrieking like a stuck pig.
A woman walked up to the kid's mother and slapped her.
If this happened around here, I would be contributing to the slapper's
Last year I saw a similar incident in a local grocery store except the
mother could not control the child. The kid had to be 9-10 years old. I
walked up to the mother and asked if she would like for me to take care of
the problem. She said if you can, yes. I looked at the kid and said I can,
and then walked over to the boy and simply said we are going to take this
out side where we will not be bothering any one, I suggest you straighten up
now. He shut up. I did this for a single mom neighbor about 10 years ago
The trick is to make a suggestion but not explain the details, let the child
imagine what could happen. ;~)
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