headers, how big? 6" 8" or 10"

[hubops]

Yep - garden shed engineers dot com - :-) John T.

[knuttle]

Somewhere in this thread it the OP said that the shed was about 10'X10'.

At that size what ever he uses for a header should be OK.

If we were talking about shed twice the size, then load stress and load bearing walls would obviously need to be consider as there is a lot more weight on the side wall.

I forget if he said the shed was permanent, ie water electricity, on a foundation or other; but in our area the only way the building inspector becomes involved is if the shed is greater the 10'X12' and permanent.

[Leon]

Because????

[Leon]

Are there really code requirements for a "shed"?

[DerbyDad03]

I'm not quite sure what you are asking about.

For simplicity let's take a 4 foot wall. Studs at each end, with 2 in the field, everything at 16" OC. I want to center a 24" window in that wall, i.e. 12" from each corner. That 24" opening is going span the 2 studs in the field, so they both have to be cut.

[DerbyDad03]

There are in my town. Not only setbacks from the property line and location on the lot, but size, construction method, foundation, power, etc.

We also have some pretty onerous fence codes too.

They don't want people going out to Home Depot, buying an 8 x 10 shed kit and setting it up in the front yard. In addition, they don't want people gathering every piece of scrap wood, plywood, particle board, etc. and building a rickety eyesore, even if the location of the shed meets code.

I could build a shed that looks really nice for a few years, but if my construction methods are a bit lax, such as nailing loft joists to the sides of studs like some people we know, things could get ugly real soon.

It's mainly about property values. Would you to have this in your neighbor's yard when you try to sell your house? ;-)

[Clare Snyder]

With 24 inch centers I'd just "move 2 studs" and "king" them - and put the window between them Double the head plate between the studs, or better yet put a "header" there - no need for jack studs. Put the moved wall studs UNDER the doubled head plate or header. Or do like they did in my house at the patio door. The joists are not hung on the rim joist, but on a "floating rim joist" suspended between the outer 2 full joists which are doubled. 4 "short joists" are hung on a displaced double "rim joist" displaced 24 inches in from the deleted rim joist on top of the concrete foundation, nailed through the doubled joists on each side

====!! !!======= ! !! !! ! ! !!==========!! ! ! !!==========!! ! ! !! ! ! ! !! ! ! !! ! ! ! !! !

[Clare Snyder]

Then whatever you do is unlikely to make the structure much less stable than it already is. Nail or better yet screw and glue a 2x6 or

2x8 across the face of the studs ACROSS THE FULL WIDTH OF THE WALL underneath the joists to support the joists, and double that across the top of the window cut out whatever you need to cut out for the window, plate it top and bottom (nailed into the plate ends through the last uncut studs, and intro the ends of the cut studs, top and bottom) The resulting structure will be stronger than what you currently have, in regards to supporting the "loft"

[Clare Snyder]

He still doesnt want to walk into the shed one morning to find everything that was in the loft yesteray is now somwhere between where the loft WAS and the floor - - - - or the siding has popped off the one wall and everything has slid out the end to the ground below, or is dangling somewhere between.

Somewhere between full code compliance and a total disaster, things need to be done to SOME sort of a "standard". Joists nailed to the studs of a "balloon framed" building without some sort of support heping support the load is not a terribly good idea. The last old balloon framed building I saw stripped to the walls had blocking of some sort between the studs where the joists were supported. That was about 10 or 15 years ago up in Sault St Marie - and the studs were FULL 2X6 fir or hemlock old growth lumber, and harderthan the hubs of hell!! Picture straight grain fir lumber 20 feet long,on 12 inch centers all around a 20X30 ft house, and on the gable ends, up to 36 feet for the peak of the gable - - - -. The place was likely worth almost as much for the recycled lumber as it was as a house in"The SOO" back then -- -

[DerbyDad03]

...snip...

A few years ago SWMBO and I were driving through rural Massachusetts and came across an area full of tobacco farms and their drying barns.

Some of the barns were really old and some were almost brand new. We stopped to chat with a local resident who was walking along the road and learned that the new barns were the result of the "reclaimed wood" trend.

Furniture companies and home builders would negotiate with the farm owners and come to an agreement related to the barns. I don't know the exact details, but it was basically "I'll replace all the wood on the outside of that barn if you'll let me have the old planks."

The "reclaimed wood" trend is profitable enough for the companies to supply the labor and parts to rebuild the barns so they can resell the old wood. I'm sure that there are lots of details behind all that, such as the quality of the wood, the condition of the barn's bones, etc. but that's the general concept.

[hubops]

My father-in-law once told me that the big main beams in his 100 + year old barn were basswood. ... in my thoughts many years later - when the subsequent owner tore-down the barn - not sure if anyone re-claimed anything or not. - a big truck-load of basswood for the carving crowd, maybe ?

I don't recall any rush to re-claim tobacco kilns' wood in our area - they rotted away when the ginsing craze took over. ... I wonder if it would stink forever ? John T.

[dpb]

On 8/13/2020 2:40 PM, Clare Snyder wrote: ...

I've still got a stack of clear 20-ft Doug fir 2x8, -10, and 12's from the bins we built in the back of the barn for the feedmill in late '50s...

The barn framing itself is old-growth SYP with some built-up columns of

2x6 and 2x8 as long as 24-ft. Nothing 36', though.

Purchased about 25,000 bdft of what turned out to be walnut from the demolition of an old school in Lynchburg, VA, built in the late 1840s to not long after Civil War when last major wing added. It varied from 2x8 to 4x16 in lengths from 16-ft to almost 40-ft.

It was just stacked the morning they opened for the sale; I had gone down to get a piece of slate blackboard for the kids' room when saw stuff sitting there that looked like something other than just old, dirty lumber...a little whittling on the corner of a few revealed just what it actually was...

Offered $5K on the spot for the lot and they took the check! (And threw in the blackboard section, gratis...)

Called Mr Davis at Davis Paint to send one of the flatbeds with the forklift...we stored it in the 3rd-subbasement where he had set up a shop for friend turning out decoupage plaques in that craze period in late '60s/early 70s....we ended up running up to 40,000 bd-ft/year of soft maple through the shop making the wood 2" thick bottoms for Craddock-Terry shoe company a few years later.

[hubops]

Great story - thanks for sharing. Some old growth is still available to be re-claimed - but it's at the bottom of the rivers & lakes :-) .. it doesn't sell cheap. John T.

[dpb]

They've turned the old Craddock Terry building into a new boutique hotel...

[Leon]

He did not state exactly where the window would be, did he? If you need to put the opening in a specific spot, you might need to cut two studs, but not necessity.

[DerbyDad03]

That is exactly what I said way back on 12th.

John T said: "Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?"

To which I replied: "You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space where 2 studs exist."

Doesn't that sound almost exactly like your "If you need to put the opening in a specific spot, you might need to cut two studs..."

I used the word *if*. I detailed the exact situation in which 2 studs would need to be cut. I never said it was a necessity.

That's why your "Because????" question didn't make sense to me. I know you know how to build a wall so I couldn't figure out why you were questioning my description of when 2 studs would need to be cut. Maybe you missed my use of the word "if"?

[Sonny]

That North Wilkesboro, NC company has another cache of reclaimed lumber up for sale.

"Revient, LLC ceases operations in North Wilkesboro, NC. Auction includes (

127,000) board feet of reclaimed lumber ? (24,000) board feet of re claimed Chestnut lumber!? Huge quantity of reclaimed beams! ? ? Cherry, Maple & Poplar Slabs! - Large Quantity of reclaimed Pine - Recl aimed Maple, Cherry, Oak, Cedar and other Species! ? Reclaimed Barn Lumber! - Reclaimed Decking, Flooring and Paneling! "

Sonny

[Leon]

ok,ok,ok, ;~)

[pyotr filipivich]

[e-mail] on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 18:42:08 -0400 typed in rec.woodworking the following:

Rebuilt.

Started with a 10x10 shed, which had rotting floors and a roof in need of "help". But the walls seemed sound so. the obvious thing to do was tear off the roof & sheathing, save the trusses, separate the walls at the NW & SW corners (leaving two walls connected. That way they'll stand by themselves and not fall over).rip up the old flooring, salvage the concrete 12" square stepping 'stones', make up a new foundation using concrete rounds from the septic company's scrap pile* as 'posts'. Lay them out in a grid pattern, "level" them to some extent (A simple procedure involving lasers), and put the 4x4 beams length wise (16' long). Frame up PT 2x4s for the floor and glue & nail the 5/4 (I think) flooring. Remount the walls ( a simple procedure after repairing some of the dry rot. Realize that the rafters aren't going to line up if I have the six foot "inserts" catywompus from each other. Drop the East wall. No, literally, the rig to lower the wall twisted, and it fall down go boom. No great damage. So now the North wall is free standing, the West and South walls are in place and the East wall is slid south to mate with it's old corner. For reasons of budget, the six foot panels have studs on 24" centers. Made sense at the time. Realize that I have the wrong joist hangers, get 'the right ones'. I'm using ten foot 2x8's because 16 footers are too expensive. Laid down the loft flooring, mostly the old sheathing now repurposed as "floor". Yes it leaves large gaps,they will serve as access to the storage area. After considering various configurations for said storage area, and having the idea of a Gambrel roof vetoed by the property owner, I went with a simple 3 1/2 foot knee or half wall around the perimeter, and the rafters going on top. Unfortunately, a 10x10 shed does not have enough rafters, and Carlin the six foot tall midget knocked out replacements in jig time. He's good, really good. After that it was a simple procedure to add the additional T1 sheathing to the open sides, cut and install same for the knee wall, sheath the roof, throw a tarp on it and call the roofers.** Borrow Rob's spray painter again, and after scoring 6 gallons of Sherwin Williams miss-tint paint for $2 a gallon. paint it green. Then paint the inside white: walls, floors, ceiling, (but not the loft.) Done

Left out of this was the fun of finding out how the power was supplied, what the code required for running a formal connection to the other outbuilding, and discovering that while I could relocate the power to the shed from the North wall to the West wall, it didn't leave me enough to move the outlets up where I wanted them. (it is a shed/shop, why put the outlets at floor level?) That will get fix someday in the future. Maybe.

In sum: 10x10 shed had the walls reused on a new 10 by 16 foundation/ floor with a three foot addition on top. I bought a Compound Mitre saw, a second cordless drill & reciprocating saw, a water level, laser level and "stuff" (Yes, that is a line item.)

I did not install any windows at the time, nor finish off the interior. Just decanted two storage units into Greenwich. "It fit". As always "If I'd known then, what I know now,I wouldn't have done it that way, if at all".

So now, what was formerly the Storage Shed, has become the Shop and Storage. The "office" stuff moved from Green shed to Blue shed, the "shop" got moved out of the other Blue outbuilding, with the bench up against the South Wall. However, I do not want to put a five foot window on the south wall, which faces the alley. However, accessing the north wall requires moving 5x10by7 feet of boxes etc, and there is no place currently for doing so. But I can now get to the west Wall, having only moved out half the western world and there is a 2x2ft square window from a previous acquisition. However, about the middle of where I can access the west wall is where the 16" OC studs meet the 24" OC studs coming the other way. From the North: 24", 24". 24".3". 16", 16" door frame, and so on.

I'm just going to cut the 3rd (24") and 4th (3"), below the joist hangers, stick a header below said joist hangers, with a king stud at each end. Maybe, seeing how it goes, use the cut stud as a jack stud, or cut it off to support the window sill. "We'll get started and see how it flows organically." (Snerk. Yes, I have said that, but I was trying to get the bookcases and shelving setup in a living room which was mostly full of boxed books at the time.) Then insulate and finish the west wall, and attempt to get to the north wall. And move everything in the Blue building about 4" to the East, sot he Steamer Trunk will fit in there. Then in September ....

Of course, If I'd won the lottery anytime in the last four years, this would be moot. I'd've torn it all down and put in a 2 1/2 car garage. Or rent/buy commercial space. But my rich uncle got didn't get out of the poor house, but was transferred to the old folks home, and so I'm having to do this all on my own. I need new hobbies.

tschus pyotr

*when they saw holes in the side of a circular tank / pipe, they get a core about 18" Dia & 5" thick'. Really handy for all sorts of uses. Just watch out for the rebar.

**They have the experience, tools and could get a roof thrown up in far less time than I could.

[pyotr filipivich]

swalker on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 19:31:40 -0500 typed in rec.woodworking the following:

With the Cornoa, that'll take too long. B-)

Normally I just take the drawing to church and talk with Petros about it at coffee hour. (He's the one who told me about "It's not a 'deck', it is a 'wildlife observation platform'!"