Grizzly jointers

Why would someone buy this *new* jointer at 365 pounds, when they could have the G0490 for the same price, at 200 pounds more. Because they had a weak back? Makes me wonder whether the days of the G0490 are numbered..
http://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-8-x-76-Parallelogram-Jointer-with-Mobile-Base/G0857
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On Wednesday, January 9, 2019 at 10:18:18 PM UTC-6, Bill wrote:

-Mobile-Base/G0857
I've never seen Grizzly's tools in person. Assuming from the pics (colors /paint)....
The beds' support may be aluminum, reducing the weight, compared to the G04 90, which may have a cast iron beds' support. May need to be field tested , long term, to see if the lighter (if so) bed support will hold up (potent ial stress fractures?) as well as the cast iron.
If the mobile base is highly sufficient, then opting for the heavier tool s hould be, may be a better choice, I would tend to think.
Sonny
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On 1/9/2019 11:18 PM, Bill wrote:

You'd need to be a moron to buy either when you can get one with a spiral cutter head for a few dollars more. After owning both types, I would never buy, on purpose, a planer or jointer w/o a segmented spiral cutter head. The difference is night and day, but the cost, in this case, is just $30 more.
By "on purpose" I mean I might hesitantly buy a 3 bladed model if I needed one, and some one was selling one in perfect condition for 20 cents on a dollar, or less, and, I was short on money...
--
Jack
Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.
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Jack wrote:

Point well-taken, but of course you meant to type "$300" more.
Since we are on this topic, IIRC, the "regular" carbide cutters are not particularly cheap. But I know that in the metalworking world, there are cutters available (on E-bay) at much less cost. Are such "less costly" cutters available for jointers too, and can anyone report on their performance?

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On 1/10/2019 2:16 PM, Bill wrote:

No, I meant $30. Surprised me as well, but I got the numbers directly from the page you listed above, just scroll down a little:
Model: G0857 $1,295.00 Item# G0656X $1,325.00

Not cheap, Grizz sells 10 packs for $40 and you would need 4 packs, around $160. The good news is they are carbide, last a REALLY long time, and since they have four sides you simply rotate them if they get dull. A typical home work shop may never need to replace them, and a commercial shop can afford to replace them. More good news is setting the cutters is automatic, no adjustments needed. They simply screw in and your done.
--
Jack
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On 1/11/2019 9:33 AM, Jack wrote:

...
"A" jointer, yes, but not the same jointer with the spiral head option...the G0656X is dovetail ways, not parallelogram design.
If you also look more carefully, that's a special sale price right now; the normal list is more like $1700.
Now, I personally don't care a whit about the two styles having had an old 8" Delta dating from the Rockwell-Delta days and the tables are still coplanar after some 60+ years so the scare tactics on how the dovetails wear and drop the tables just doesn't live up to the hype for me...
But, "Yes, Virginia", you _could_ get one for essentially the same price right now it appears.
--dpb
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On 1/11/2019 10:50 AM, dpb wrote:

We must have the same jointer. Mine is about 65 years old and a 6" but also has remained perfectly coplanar, so that seems to be not an issue. Segmented spiral cutter however is a big issue.

Yes, $30 more, which is what I said. Can't imagine why anyone would buy the other one, regardless of it's weight or fancy adjustment mechanism. My self, I rarely to never adjust the tables other than after knife sharpening. Even if the price was $300 more, I would not hesitate to buy the spiral head. Worth much much more than that in performance.
--
Jack
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On 1/12/2019 7:24 AM, Jack wrote:

A) I wasn't arguing that, only that the comparison Bill made was valid, too.
B) Just the bigger brother, yes... :)
I raise/lower infeed table all the time...I'm one who's still old-school enough to actually use the rabbet table extension, taper legs, etc., etc, etc., ... besides just joint an edge.
I've thought a time or two about upgrading the head, but with sharp knives I really don't find the tearout issue to be a problem...I'd far prefer to have them on the old PM Model 180 planer, but there we are talking "big bucks!".
--




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On 1/12/2019 11:33 AM, dpb wrote:

I experimented with that stuff once or twice when I first got my jointer. Decided jointer not right tool for that stuff (for me). Tapers and rabbets I always cut on table saw. Further more, I set my out feed table for a 1/32" cut and never change it. I know 1 pass is 1/32, two is 1/16th.
As far as coplanar, I don't believe mine is even adjustable. It was ground coplanar at the factory and should never need adjustment, far as I know. If it was, I would screw that up in a second.

I'd upgrade in a pair of seconds if I was just starting rather than just ending my "career". Someone makes replacement spiral cutter heads for most planers and jointers for not all that much money. Edge jointing not needed much but for face jointing, a major bonus. Of course, if just starting I wouldn't/didn't know this, which is my reason for harping on the issue here when it comes up, possibly save someone from making that mistake.
--
Jack
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On 1/12/2019 12:20 PM, Jack wrote:

You set your "out feed" table for 1/32" cut?
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On 1/12/2019 2:30 PM, Leon wrote:

In feed table.
--
Jack
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On 1/9/2019 10:18 PM, Bill wrote:

Shipping costs.
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On 1/9/2019 10:18 PM, Bill wrote:

only shows 24 lb difference and you don't know where that is...the descriptions say the G0857 base cabinet is "sheet metal" while the other is "pre-formed steel"...the only Al mentioned in either is the knife guard is Al on the G0857 but that can't be but a pound or less at most...
Taiwan vs China is the biggest difference...
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Wot? G0490: "Approximate shipping weight: 562 lbs." G0857: "Approximate shipping weight: 365 lbs." ------- = 197 lbs
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On 1/10/2019 4:32 PM, Spalted Walt wrote:

Shipping weight is _NOT_ machine weight...look at the comparison charts -- I thought the previous link would reload the chart but I hadn't checked and see it didn't...here's the data under "Product Dimensions" tab for the two...
G0857 G0490 Weight (lbs.)     484 508
Overall Width (side-to-side) 76 76-3/8 in.                 
Overall Depth (front-to-back) 25 24 in.                       Overall Height 41-1/2 45-1/2 in.                       Footprint Width 16 16-1/2 in.                       Footprint Length 40 44-1/2 in.
You can use <http://www.grizzly.com/compare?category=Jointers&preload=G0857|G0490> to preload the main comparison page for the two machines...
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On 1/10/2019 9:33 PM, dpb wrote:

Didn't get the rest first try...to see where the weight difference comes from, look at "Shipping Dimensions" tab -- the G0857 is shipped in one crate at 477 lbs while the G0490 is in two -- 402 + 162 lbs = 568 total shipping weight.
But, the data can't be totally correct, either...the G0857 is supposed to weigh 484 but the shipping weight is 7 lb less.
The numbers for the G0490 do at least come reasonable close--within 2 lbs of the "approximate" figure above but the 365 appears to just be totally bogus.
I'd not draw any firm conclusions from any of it...about what you'd expect from a low-cost import distributor--"cheap/inexpensive, but precision and high attention to detail ain't what you're really expecting".
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dpb wrote:

But, the way I understand it, they have dominated this part of the market with their lower "price/performance" ratio to the point that few wish to compete with them in it. I think Baileigh is going to try, but I don't see them advertise like Grizzly. Could be I'm not paying attention.
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On 1/10/2019 11:26 PM, Bill wrote:

While I've never had a Grizzly and actually have never seen one firsthand, apparently they are the most consistent of the imports and what isn't right they do fix.
The cost pressures have driven the US makers overseas as well and Delta is only a shadow of its former self and may well be following Sears' business model the rate they're going.
One of the Grizzly machines won both Best Overall and Best Value in last month's Fine WW review of segmented-head 8" jointers...
Just that if price sensitivity is a major driver, there just can't be much time spent on the details like the data accuracy of web pages--it would be too time-consuming and take too many manhours that would inevitably add.
--


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15% faster cutterhead?
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