Damned Amazon sent me some emails this morning suggesting some things I might like, and the bastards were right. Reminded me that my old 14V Porter Cable cordless drill has just about outlived its usefulness, and now I'm looking at these two puppies:
Leon always has the best cordless drills of anyone I know on a job site, and he seems to have plenty to choose from ... might want to get him to chime in.
one brand is 1.5 AH and the other 3 AH... go for the bigger ones. The brand is less important as both Makita and Milwaukee are credible.
I have this Makita set:
In news:hi7nbe$tqc$ snipped-for-privacy@news.eternal-september.org, Steve Turner spewed forth:
I think you can do better on the price if you don't mind recon'd i bought the Milwaukee for $119 from Toolking on their tool of the day a couple months ago, but now they only show this one.
However, lithium batteries (like other rechargeables) have a limited number of recharge cycles so you're going to have to replace/rebuild them twice as often as the bigger batteries.
Chris
Yep. It's a weight trade off thing for me. A battery is a consumable, but my back can be a nagging pain. ;)
R
Over all I have been most satisfied with my Milwaukee drills. I have not tried the Makita you picture, but my current truck gun (in my service truck for daily use) is the Milwaukee you have pictured. Except for the stupidly high price of extra batteries I am very happy with it.
Well... it was me I'd go for the Bosch 38636.
I've always liked Bosch and Makita and never had a problem with any of their tools. Milwaukee -- not so much.
Gordon Shumway
Our Constitution needs to be used less as a shield for the guilty and more as a sword for the victim.
Typically all things being equal most all manufacturers say that the L-ion will last twice as long per charge and can be recharged twice as many times as the NiMh...
Nailshootrer has seen contrary evidence.
My excperience with a L-ion Bosch impact driver 18 volt 1.5 amp is that it lasts as long as the 2.6 amp 12 volt Nihd Makita.
I have had quite an assortment in the last 30 years as far as cordless drivers are concerned. In the last 15 years I have had Panasonic, DeWalt, Makita, and Bosch.
The Bosch is however a 1.5 amp 18 volt L-ion impact driver. I also have a Makita 12 Volt 2.6 amp NiNh impact. Performance between the two is about the same although the Bosch with the higher voltage "seems" to have a bit more power. I still prefer the Makita over the Bosch. Cordless Makita drills have been around longer than most and IMHO you cannot go wrong with that brand. I have broken several Bosch corded drills and never broken any other brand. I have even broken a Bosch sander, right Swingman? ;~)
There seems to be some contrary to good reports about the Milwaukee battery holding a charge. I would buy a Milwaukee corded drill in a heart beat although I can not seem to kill my corded DeWalt which has built several decks in the last 16 years.
IMHO Panasonic makes the absolute best unless something has changed recently and you cannot go wrong with the Makita.
On Fri, 08 Jan 2010 10:43:24 -0600, the infamous Steve Turner scrawled the following:
I haven't tried lithiums yet, but the articles say "Get the 3AH batts OR ELSE!" If you're working for a living, don't try the cheapos, as they don't have the battery life -or- the balls.
-- We rightly care about the environment. But our neurotic obsession with carbon betrays an inability to distinguish between pollution and the stuff of life itself. --Bret Stephens, WSJ 1/5/10
you are looking at is the entry level drill and is not there best. If you don't mind reconditioned (if Milwaukee did the recon then I wouldn't hesitate) here is something to look at.
I have a Milwaukee 18v Lion and it works great.
Allen
"Martin H. Eastburn" wrote in news:u0S1n.4332 $ snipped-for-privacy@en-nntp-01.dc.easynews.com:
I'll agree with that. My LiON batteries are sitting in the garage now, recharging after dieing half way through an ice rink build. It's only 1F outside, maybe I should leave them on the snow instead of putting them back on the case.
Puckdropper
All things being equal, it seems that the larger any type of battery is, and given it is properly cared for, you will rebuild it less.
However there is a curve on the lower powered batteries (also of any type) that will require them to be rebuilt more often under steady use since they will be cycled more frequently during use.
But apparently it isn't as simple as "this one has half the amp hours so it will last half as long." Complicated explanations were given to me about how batteries work that indicate that (for example) a 1.5mh battery will have less than 1/2 the effective usable life of a 3mh battery, not exactly 1/2.
*********** > Typically all things being equal most all manufacturers say that the L-ionOne thing I learned when I was absolutely beating the whole battery issue to death was that no matter the chemical composition or rating of the battery, the are not created equal. I have no doubt as to the validity of your experience.
Setting aside charge times, many QUALITY NiCds will out perform Li and NiMh batteries. And the same goes for any variant of that equation.
Whilst on my mission, I found the city's largest battery rebuilder literally two blocks from my house. They rebuild for the police and fire department, the sheriff's dept., several hospitals, and several maintenance companies.
According to "Robert" at Mtronics (no, not this one), Li batteries are fine for video equipment including cameras and recorders. He also likes them for phones and for radios, in other words devices that have low, steady drain. He hates them in anything else and won't provide a usable warranty for Li rebuilds.
He recommends NiMh batteries for maintenance people or for any other service industry that uses a device that can be recharged overnight, on a daily basis. Their lack of memory and ability to charge fully in a short time is the key there. They also stand a variable drain better in something like a drill in which you require much more power if you need to really lean on a drill to use it.
I took his suggestion on my Makita drill that I carry in the truck and went back to NiCad.
I was pumped about Li batteries for my drills as I have had great luck with them in my digital cameras. But Bob steered me away with the MSDS sheets he provided from two different battery suppliers they use.
Li batteries have a 2 -3 year useful life. That' it. I am sure someone here has had their for 25 years and counting, but even the manufacturers don't claim more than that. Additionally, you aren't supposed to use them until they absolutely die. You will damage the batteries. Worse, if you don't keep them charged properly, they will die on their own, even if they are new.
Now the kicker. Stored in the truck, my drill has to be ready to go when I need it. I rotate batteries out so the one hour I spend on a NiCad has never been a problem for me. They hold their charge in all manner of inclement weather, humidity, etc., even tossed in the tool box where they live.
Li batteries are not that hardy. They do not like cold, and cold will ruin them. They do not like heat (uh oh... tough living in South Texas with that caveat!) and will discharge rapidly and can be easily ruined in normal heat.
This is a quick three page read on Li batteries:
Note the lack of cycles on these Li batteries, and then rhink of the actual useful cycles that could imply. Not good. Then check out the italicized statement that "higher temperatures, above 68 degrees reduce the battery storage life.
My tools don't ride in the air conditioning, and my little shop isn't air conditioned either. I don't know when that battery would have the pleasure of not being more than 68 degrees in temperature.
Information abounds on these batteries, and if you look into what tool users say, the casual guys seem fine with the Li batteries and the daily users don't care for them.
There is hope on the horizon, though. Sanyo (branded as eneloop) and one other company has a second generation Li battery design that is much sturdier, and in tests (not by them!) they only lose 15% off a full charge unattended and unused for a full year.
If they get the temp problem solved, that could be a great battery.
Robert
It is the old, "Pay me now or pay me later" game.
These batteries have a "Mean cycles to end of life" design parameter.
IOW, you have a known number of charge cycles to reach end of life, and know I don't know the number.
Something to consider, batteries don't like to get hot.
Recharging a battery gets it hot.
Want to extend the service life of a battery?
Use at least 3 batteries for continuous duty applications.
Stated another way, try to limit the number of recharge cycles of a battery to once per day.
Doesn't save you any money, but solves the problem of being 40 ft up a ladder with only 5 more screws to drive, you know you'll get it done.
HTH
Lew
Just in case you may have thought I was tooting the horn for L-ion, I was not. LOL
IMHO a 18 bolt 1.5 amp battery lasting as long as a 2.6 amp 12 volt battery is nothing to brag about other than the fact that the battery is smaller and lighter weight.
I never used either one, but I picked up the Makita at a local store and fell in love with it immediately. It fit my hand really, really nicely and is super light weight. At first I thought it didn't have a battery in it, but it did.. This thing weighs about 3 pounds or so. I was hell bent on getting a small 12 volt drill but couldn't decide on the Milwaukee or the Bosch. After holding this one in my hand, I have to say it feels really good. It was so light I wondered about the durability... Makita has a good name though, and my Makita hammer drill has been great for many years.
I know I would not buy any drill with out holding it in my hand to see how it feels. This one would be perfect in my "part time" home shop.
Dunno why, really, but that just cracked me up. Advance warning next time, please.
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