That _is_ one of the later NEC items I do tend to ignore in non-wet/indoor locations like a shop...probably the most common one , in fact. :)
Bill should, of course, follow local Code requirements (disclaimer :) )
Having recently purchased my home, I think it is the case that our local code (central IN) requires GFCI on outlets within a short distance of a sink/bath except older homes may be grandfathered out of this requirement. However, needless to say, I am not an expert.
Bill
just a small caveat to this statement, as I had to consider this in my shop. Both a given power tool, perhaps the table saw, and the dust collection system will probably be on the same time. Be sure to add both loads together to make sure a circuit is large enough. Oh, and don't forget that your air compressor will more than likely kick on at this inopportune time as well.
Harvey
Uhhh, _excuse_ me??? The part you so judiciously snipped continued...
"so, other than the one tool, the only other loads active simultaneously will be the potential DC and maybe a compressor."
For 30A/240V, 10A each will be in the neighborhood of 3hp FLA motors. I submit for the home shop dude just getting going as is OP he'll have far more than enough...
If'en he's going w/ 5hp PM and an Oneida central DC, well ok but I don't get that feeling here, do you???
--
Besides kitchens and bathroom, most locales require GFCI protected circuits in "garages" also ... a place where you, strangely enough, find most woodworking "shops" these days. :)
iwires post from "mike_holts" forum, copied and pasted below (it makes interesting reading...). --Bill
I will post the code rule for GFCIs in basements below but the short version is 15 and 20 amp 120 volt receptacles must have GFCI protection.
You have a few options.
1)Install a 2 pole 120/240 GFCI breaker at the panel and protect both the 120 and 240 outlets.2)Use a standard 2 pole breaker at the panel go to your 240 outlets first then install a GFCI outlet at the first two (each leg of the 3 wire cable) 120 receptacles and protect all receptacles down line with those GFCIs
3)Use a standard two pole breaker at the panel and go in any order with the 120 and 240 outlets but install a GFCI outlet at each 120 volt location.IMO keep the 240 outlets on a separate breaker, by the time you jump through hoops to do this you will have spent as much as running a 2 wire home run for the 240 outlets.
Here is the code rule.
210.8(A) Dwelling Units. All 125-volt, single-phase, 15- and 20-ampere receptacles installed in the locations specified in (1) through (8) shall have ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection for personnel.(5)Unfinished basements ? for purposes of this section, unfinished basements are defined as portions or areas of the basement not intended as habitable rooms and limited to storage areas, work areas, and the like
Exception No. 1: Receptacles that are not readily accessible.
Exception No. 2: A single receptacle or a duplex receptacle for two appliances located within dedicated space for each appliance that, in normal use, is not easily moved from one place to another and that is cord-and-plug connected in accordance with 400.7(A)(6), (A)(7), or (A)(8).
Exception No. 3: A receptacle supplying only a permanently installed fire alarm or burglar alarm system shall not be required to have ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection.
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I trust you are not interpreting that to mean that ALL 15 and 20 amp 120 volt receptacles must have GFCI protection?
BTW, what's a "basement"? :)
I copied & pasted below from:
I quote: "When determining where to install a subpanel, be sure to follow the National Electrical Code (NEC) requirements. In front of the subpanel, you?ll need free working space that?s 36 in. deep and at least as wide as the subpanel (or 30 in. wide ? whichever is greater). The space above the panel must be completely open to the structural ceiling (no shelving, etc.), and the space below must be open to the floor (no lawnmowers, trash cans, workbenches, etc.)."
Am I to understand from this that if a subpanel is mounted flush on a wall, that nothing is to be place in FRONT of it (ever)? It comes down to where it is written: "the space below must be open to the floor"---does that refer to the space directly below the subpanel or include the 36" in front of it mentioned earlier. Otherwise, I'd have what--a fire violation?
This may conflict with one of our "valuable space axioms" that Roy, IIRC, mentioned before.
Just Curious, Bill
You may be spot on this. I only do commercial industrial so I'm not right up on residential but I believe all garage circuits require gfi. There are exceptions for appliances and dedicated circuits. May be a drawback garage shops, but I think most repair shops are now required to have gfi circuits. Mike M
It's a 10-4 that you would have an "electrical code violation",
That said, when the inspector leaves most home owners go ahead and make a clothes closet out of that "machine room" .... if you now what I mean. :)
We are required in most municipalities where I build to have GFI protection on all "wet area" receptacles ... this includes bathroom, utility rooms with sinks, kitchens, garages, sun rooms with drains, and all exterior receptacles.
We are also required to have AFCI protection on all dwelling bedroom circuits.
On the latter, I've had homeowners who are selling a home I built when AFCI wasn't required, or even available, and during the sale process failed a buyer's third party inspection because lack of AFCI protection, I've gone back and had the electrical contractor install them at our cost ... seems like good business, and a prudent thing to do in this litigious society.
I can see where thats good business. The more people that have something good to say about how you do business is good for repeat and referal customers. A good reputation leads to a lot more negotiated business and being able to sell on quality and fair price instead of just cheap.
Mike M
I just wished to double-check that this was supposed to be "Install 2P-30A branch c'bkr for each 240V stationary tool along with non fused disconnect at (within 10ft) the tool."
This is correct, right? Is is fair to assume that most 15A tools also have a fuse or internal shut-off system of their own?
I really feel I am close to knowing everything I will need to wire a subpanel, some minor but important details concerning wire size, etc., I can easily look up (I will err on the side of safety).
Meeting all code requirements raises the bar higher. For instance, I haven't investigated whether one's conduit is expected to covered by wallboard. Someone suggested that panels and subpanels are supposed to have a front/backing board for instance (to cover/protect some of the wiring).
I wish to note that I appreciate the kind, thoughtful and useful help that I have received here. Learning how to do new things (or even old things, like constructing a wooden plane) seems to raise my happiness-quotient. : )
Bill
IME, don't even bother with 15 amp circuits, except maybe for lights.
In many locales today at least 12 ga wire is required throughout, and it is simply too easy to use 12 ga and go with 20 amp c'brks for your 120v tools.
Not really enough of a cost savings for the ultimate flexibility benefit.
That's exactly what I was planning to do--I'm prudently choosing safety over (false!) economy. I expect that such decisions will nullify such factors such as a temperature of 10 degrees in the winter and 95 degrees in the summer... But, by all means, please stop me if I expect something wrongly! :)
BTW, the IM for the 15A saw I was looking at suggests putting the saw on a 20A circuit.
Bill
That'll work.
It's ok, but imo as discussed earlier, it's way overkill for a home shop unless you've got some _serious_ 240V gear, here to run a completely independent circuit for every tool. It would take something approaching a 5hp motor to draw 30A assuming only 50% overall efficiency and that would have to be at full output; rarely does a tool require that. And, breakers are designed to handle the short-term surge of a starting current so it's not like that's a real problem, either. Plus, there's the factor of how many of these tools can/will you be using at a time as well.
And again, unless you're hardwiring the tool (dispensing w/ the cordset/plug) the non-fused disconnect _is_ the plug; there's no need for anything any fancier in a home shop and particularly if it's a garage it could be quite inconvenient to have them essentially permanently tethered.
Comes down to what are you really wiring here--a home shop or a commercial business shop kinda' thing? Of course, if $$ is no concern, go for the gold...
$0.02, imo, ymmv, etc., etc., etc., ...
-dpb
--
You did a pretty job assessing my situation earlier--it was kind of you to go out of your way to write that the OP probably wasn't setting up shop for a commerical business. Borrowing a title from Hemmingway, I am after "A Clean Well-Lighted Place", and a place where I can build some of the things I would like to build. Paraphrasing something Lew wrote, "a place with a captain's seat" (too). I actually have one of those, but it is surrounded by books and there is no room for sawdust there.
I spent 20 minutes walking meditatively around my "Untidy Mildy-Lit Place" this evening with a measuring tape. I noted, sort of proud of my new knowledge, that I could see someone had moved an overhead light to 37" in front of the main panel--it had evidentally been in the space described (roughtly) in the NEC as "that space, 36" outward from the main panel,
30 inches wide, open to the ceiling and to the floor that must remain free space". I noted violations of this policy that were not found during our house's inspection. It won't matter now though because lots of stuff is coming down--kitchen cupboards (that look hideous), all the wall board on at least one wall--the matter of a few feet of wire is non-consequential. 240v DC, TS, and Air Compressor, none of which I have, merit their own circuits. Tools on 120v circuits can afford to do more sharing since probably only one will be powered at a time.Q) ShouId I leave a few inches of the wallboard around the main panel and existing outlets and switches (which will remain live) for any reason? BTW, I imagine it will take some accurate measuring to cut wallboard to fit my panel and subpanel (and outlets, etc). I noted that it will requires 2 pieces to fit around a panel. Going this far, I might as well add insulation to this wall too. Concerning the wall without the panels, I ponder whether I need to put any wallboard back up. --I obviously need to get one of those wiring books so I don't become an "electrical-pest" around here!
After my 20 minute inspection, I came in from my shop-to-be feeling a little wiser, a little readier, and with the suspicions that I'm getting read to make the biggest mess I ever made! : ) I will have to to cut everything into small pieces so my refuse company will haul it away week by week in the usual can. That effort will probably more than pay for any wire I use.. : ) I'll decide more after I find how much it cost this weekend! ; )
Best, Bill
The main thing in running your circuits at this point is to get good wiring in the walls. As was stated don't run less then #12. If in doubt for the future run a 12-3 or 10-3 wire set up and cap the unused wire. In the future if you need to have 240 at a outlet you have the extra wire. Depending on your construction its wise to install some conduit, flex or smurf tube to be able to pull additional circuits, cable or phone lines. If you have an accessible attic a lot of this can be done as risers for future use.
Mike M
Mike, Thank you for some very good ideas!
I DO HAVE an accessible attic, and I believe that most, if not all, of the wires from the main panel go right up to it. I had been debating with myself whether to wire "through the attic" or through the studs. One factor is that the wall I wish to add the outlets to first tops out at the eaves. I thought that a combination would be easiest--attic to a wall, down, and then through the studs. No NEC violations in sight, right??? Anything to be wary of (the attic is not living space)? Do you agree that this makes sense, even if I have to rip down a bunch of wallboard to do it?
Bill
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